News

Comment by: shaffaaf (May 07, 2008 19:22)

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and the numbers are?
give mew a estimate, I don't doubt it but would like more info =^^=

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From the BBC article:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/7386879.stm

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Sony's PlayStation 3 games console has outsold Microsoft's Xbox 360 in Europe, according to figures released by Sony.

More than five million PS3s have been sold across the continent, Sony's David Reeves confirmed.

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mmm not even the normal "shipped", its actually sold.

well done sony.

Comment by: ZeusAV (May 07, 2008 19:40)

Considering the fact that MS just had a large EU price cut across the board a few months back for the 360, this is looking pretty bad for them. Even though their American customers are pretty loyal, it's going to be hard to win a console war with only one market.

Comment by: pirkster (May 07, 2008 20:02)

It also punctuates the fact that Sony and Nintendo market globally better than the American focused Microsoft XBOX division.

Sure, the 360 would like to do better to reach the globe, they just don't to nearly as good a job as Sony or Nintendo.

That will change in time. After all, they are the noob to the console scene compared to the other two.

Comment by: SDF_GR (May 07, 2008 20:18)

Originally posted by ZeusAV:

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Considering the fact that MS just had a large EU price cut across the board a few months back for the 360, this is looking pretty bad for them. Even though their American customers are pretty loyal, it's going to be hard to win a console war with only one market.

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^ agree.
Europe always had more PS fans than XB.
I believe thow that Blu-ray was an ace for PS3.
Lets see what MS will do when (and if) same thing happens to US.
Will they release a BD x360 then?

Comment by: iluvendo (May 08, 2008 00:10)

For how long ??

Comment by: viny1313 (May 08, 2008 02:35)

Lmao I'm gonna rub this in all of my friends faces >:)

Damn 360 loyalists...

Anyways, this is a surprise to me after they had that big price cut... I figured this wpu;dn't happened until Sony faught mack with their own price cut...

Comment by: varnull (May 08, 2008 02:50)

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according to figures released by Sony.

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hahahahaha.. I have sold more Gary Glitter cd's in Europe this year than sony have.. according to figures released by varnull !!!

Talk about spin and BS. I have yet to meet a ps3 owner in the flesh and know 9 360 owners.. locally it's not true.

Yet more non-news from the sony camp..

I call shenanagins !!

Free open source software = made by end users who want an application to work....

Comment by: shaffaaf (May 08, 2008 03:15)

show me your basis and facts varnull. i am sure sony can back up what they say, and most likely so can charts.

just becuase alot of your friends dont have a ps3, doesnt mean the rest of europe doesnt.

Comment by: nobrainer (May 08, 2008 06:18)

Originally posted by shaffaaf:

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show me your basis and facts varnull. i am sure sony can back up what they say, and most likely so can charts.

just becuase alot of your friends dont have a ps3, doesnt mean the rest of europe doesnt.

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w8 for reliably niki or npd data to arrive as david reeves also stated that the ps3 copy of GTA4 was outselling the 360 ver 3 to 1, when shops stated it was the other way around!

what reeves fails to mention that the other next-gen console the wii has obliterated both the ps3 and 360 because their games are fun and not carbon copies of pc titles.

NOTE to Mr Reeves if you are going to issue data about next-gen consoles please don't cherry pick!

Public relations Spin

Originally posted by hyper:

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In public relations, spin is a sometimes pejorative term signifying a heavily biased portrayal in one's own favor of an event or situation. While traditional public relations may also rely on creative presentation of the facts, "spin" often, though not always, implies disingenuous, deceptive and/or highly manipulative tactics. Politicians are often accused of spin by commentators and political opponents, when they produce a counter argument or position. In the modern world, most PR practitioners are discouraged to use spin because it is fundamentally counterproductive to the industry's ultimate goal of building relationships with constituents.

The techniques of "spin" include Selectively presenting facts and quotes that support one's position (cherry picking), the so-called "non-denial denial," Phrasing in a way that assumes unproven truths, euphemisms for drawing attention away from items considered distasteful, and ambiguity in public statements. Another spin technique involves careful choice of timing in the release of certain news so it can take advantage of prominent events in the news. A famous reference to this practice occurred when British Government press officer Jo Moore used the phrase It's now a very good day to get out anything we want to bury, (widely paraphrased or misquoted as "It's a good day to bury bad news"), in an email sent on September 11, 2001. The furor caused when this email was reported in the press eventually caused her to resign.

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Comment by: SDF_GR (May 08, 2008 18:39)

Originally posted by nobrainer:

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w8 for reliably niki or npd data to arrive as david reeves also stated that the ps3 copy of GTA4 was outselling the 360 ver 3 to 1, when shops stated it was the other way around!

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A game cant say witch console is dominating.
IMO PS3 is a more adult console than the 360, and you must be at the most 18 to play GTA.This is a teenagers game.
but that is my opinion, now how many people share this opinion... i cant say, but i'll say this, i know a lot of people but i don't know anyone playing GTA.

Comment by: nobrainer (May 08, 2008 18:57)

Originally posted by SDF_GR:

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A game cant say witch console is dominating.
IMO PS3 is a more adult console than the 360, and you must be at the most 18 to play GTA.This is a teenagers game.
but that is my opinion, now how many people share this opinion... i cant say, but i'll say this, i know a lot of people but i don't know anyone playing GTA.

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please read my entire post again and try to understand my point!

Originally posted by nobrainer:

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Originally posted by shaffaaf:

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show me your basis and facts varnull. i am sure sony can back up what they say, and most likely so can charts.

just becuase alot of your friends dont have a ps3, doesnt mean the rest of europe doesnt.

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w8 for reliably niki or npd data to arrive as david reeves also stated that the ps3 copy of GTA4 was outselling the 360 ver 3 to 1, when shops stated it was the other way around!

what reeves fails to mention that the other next-gen console the wii has obliterated both the ps3 and 360 because their games are fun and not carbon copies of pc titles.

NOTE to Mr Reeves if you are going to issue data about next-gen consoles please don't cherry pick!

Public relations Spin

Originally posted by hyper:

---

In public relations, spin is a sometimes pejorative term signifying a heavily biased portrayal in one's own favor of an event or situation. While traditional public relations may also rely on creative presentation of the facts, "spin" often, though not always, implies disingenuous, deceptive and/or highly manipulative tactics. Politicians are often accused of spin by commentators and political opponents, when they produce a counter argument or position. In the modern world, most PR practitioners are discouraged to use spin because it is fundamentally counterproductive to the industry's ultimate goal of building relationships with constituents.

The techniques of "spin" include Selectively presenting facts and quotes that support one's position (cherry picking), the so-called "non-denial denial," Phrasing in a way that assumes unproven truths, euphemisms for drawing attention away from items considered distasteful, and ambiguity in public statements. Another spin technique involves careful choice of timing in the release of certain news so it can take advantage of prominent events in the news. A famous reference to this practice occurred when British Government press officer Jo Moore used the phrase It's now a very good day to get out anything we want to bury, (widely paraphrased or misquoted as "It's a good day to bury bad news"), in an email sent on September 11, 2001. The furor caused when this email was reported in the press eventually caused her to resign.

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Comment by: varnull (May 08, 2008 19:13)

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show me your basis and facts varnull. i am sure sony can back up what they say, and most likely so can charts.

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I have sold 17 that came off a boot sale @ 10p each.. my figures.. my charts.. according to my figures sony have sold none..

sony can show me as many charts and sales figures they generate themselves as they want, until they are blue in the face.. Until the retail sales industry makes it's reports on total unit sales.. independently from the manufacturers everything else is lies, propaganda and BS.. just like my figures that I have generated myself.
They bear no relation to reality at all... we have even tried to work out if this is a weekly or total sales thing.. the figures are FROM SONY and NOT QUALIFIED in any way.

Why are we even debating this shite?? it's spin from sony.. If M$ say that THEIR FIGURES show they have sold more 360's than wii's I will call the same.. and on and on ad infinitum.

Enjoy your check from sony that must surely be in the post by now shaffaff ($$)? or whatever your name is.. we rumbled corporate mouthpieces a long time ago...

Some people can't see the stupidity in what they spout.. it's obvious I was taking the piss about this whole topic. That's all it is worth.. laughing at!

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The PlayStation 3, Sony’s latest console, has been criticized from nearly every angle by pundits, with the sales figures eliciting the most disparaging comments. Sony released a press release this morning as an answer to the NPD figures the industry has analyzed for over a year.

“The NPD data, and most other sources of data concerning console sales are wrong,” states the press release. “In fact, PS3 sales figures are damn dirty lies.”

According to Sony’s internal data, they have sold over 200 million PS3s, 467 million games, and 6.7 billion PSPs (with an average of 1.12 per person on earth).

“It’s no wonder that NPD got it so wrong,” states SCA President and CEO Jack Tretton when contacted. “I mean, the whole place is filled with dum-dums and fat idiots.”

“I know the numbers don’t look real, but I can assure you that they are,” continues Tretton. “We know how much we are making, and we know how much we are shipping.”

We asked why PS3s and PSPs are not seen more often. With millions and billions sold respectively, one assumes that you would see them on a consistent basis in social settings and in public. Jack Tretton responds: “Owning a Sony product is a great experience, and one worth being humble for. It’s like your virginity. Once you lose it, do you tell everyone and show off your broken hymen? No, of course not, but you are still proud and happy. Much like owning a PS3. It’s a private affair.”

As for the constant SKU changes? Tretton: "We keep selling out. We sell out to the point where it's not humanly possible to make more, so we have to reinvent the PS3 just to deliver more to our valued and plentiful customers"

The press release continued to shine doubt on sales figures for other consoles: “We at Sony also doubt the veracity of claims concerning the Xbox 360. We are uncertain that the console has sold a single unit, let alone the 10 millions that they claim.”

Tretton elaborates: “I’ve never met anyone with a 360, have you?” Upon telling Tretton that the interviewer indeed owns a 360, Tretton responded, “Whatev.”

As for the Nintendo Wii: “Never heard of him. Who’s Nintendo and what does his cock have to do with video games?”

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Free open source software = made by end users who want an application to work....

Comment by: iluvendo (May 08, 2008 19:24)

Varnull ( the love of my life), Well Spoken !!!!!!!! ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Comment by: shaffaaf (May 08, 2008 20:48)

i dont remember butting heads before, and why the personal attack about a cheque, i have not attacked you personally, was just viewing my opinions.

(although the £250,00 from sony helped me get my point across xD)

all i asked was for some evidence, which clearly you were lacking.

and that quote has not link....

Comment by: viny1313 (May 09, 2008 00:09)

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show me your basis and facts varnull. i am sure sony can back up what they say, and most likely so can charts.

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I have sold 17 that came off a boot sale @ 10p each.. my figures.. my charts.. according to my figures sony have sold none..

sony can show me as many charts and sales figures they generate themselves as they want, until they are blue in the face.. Until the retail sales industry makes it's reports on total unit sales.. independently from the manufacturers everything else is lies, propaganda and BS.. just like my figures that I have generated myself.
They bear no relation to reality at all... we have even tried to work out if this is a weekly or total sales thing.. the figures are FROM SONY and NOT QUALIFIED in any way.

Why are we even debating this shite?? it's spin from sony.. If M$ say that THEIR FIGURES show they have sold more 360's than wii's I will call the same.. and on and on ad infinitum.

Enjoy your check from sony that must surely be in the post by now shaffaff ($$)? or whatever your name is.. we rumbled corporate mouthpieces a long time ago...

Some people can't see the stupidity in what they spout.. it's obvious I was taking the piss about this whole topic. That's all it is worth.. laughing at!

Quote:

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The PlayStation 3, Sony’s latest console, has been criticized from nearly every angle by pundits, with the sales figures eliciting the most disparaging comments. Sony released a press release this morning as an answer to the NPD figures the industry has analyzed for over a year.

“The NPD data, and most other sources of data concerning console sales are wrong,” states the press release. “In fact, PS3 sales figures are damn dirty lies.”

According to Sony’s internal data, they have sold over 200 million PS3s, 467 million games, and 6.7 billion PSPs (with an average of 1.12 per person on earth).

“It’s no wonder that NPD got it so wrong,” states SCA President and CEO Jack Tretton when contacted. “I mean, the whole place is filled with dum-dums and fat idiots.”

“I know the numbers don’t look real, but I can assure you that they are,” continues Tretton. “We know how much we are making, and we know how much we are shipping.”

We asked why PS3s and PSPs are not seen more often. With millions and billions sold respectively, one assumes that you would see them on a consistent basis in social settings and in public. Jack Tretton responds: “Owning a Sony product is a great experience, and one worth being humble for. It’s like your virginity. Once you lose it, do you tell everyone and show off your broken hymen? No, of course not, but you are still proud and happy. Much like owning a PS3. It’s a private affair.”

As for the constant SKU changes? Tretton: "We keep selling out. We sell out to the point where it's not humanly possible to make more, so we have to reinvent the PS3 just to deliver more to our valued and plentiful customers"

The press release continued to shine doubt on sales figures for other consoles: “We at Sony also doubt the veracity of claims concerning the Xbox 360. We are uncertain that the console has sold a single unit, let alone the 10 millions that they claim.”

Tretton elaborates: “I’ve never met anyone with a 360, have you?” Upon telling Tretton that the interviewer indeed owns a 360, Tretton responded, “Whatev.”

As for the Nintendo Wii: “Never heard of him. Who’s Nintendo and what does his cock have to do with video games?”

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And how old is that quote?

Comment by: SDF_GR (May 09, 2008 14:47)

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Originally posted by SDF_GR:

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A game cant say witch console is dominating.
IMO PS3 is a more adult console than the 360, and you must be at the most 18 to play GTA.This is a teenagers game.
but that is my opinion, now how many people share this opinion... i cant say, but i'll say this, i know a lot of people but i don't know anyone playing GTA.

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please read my entire post again and try to understand my point!

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You understand my point, my point is that shops arent than reliable source.
Shops don't really know as much as they claim that they know, just by numbers, + you dont know the numbers of every shop on this planet glob.

Comment by: v965hdss (May 09, 2008 19:15)

Good to see the Japs beating the Yanks

Comment by: wetsparks (May 10, 2008 05:45)

It is true about Sony selling mores systems, and no NPD won't report it because they only report US sales. Do a little looking on the internet and you will find this to be true. And except for one month this year, the PS3 has outsold the 360 in America for, I believe, 5 of the last 6 months, that NPD did report. I won't dig for the report myself but with a little effort anyone can find it. And Varnell, Sony releases all their numbers in their annual financial reports, you lie in those you go to jail, so it isn't "PR spin."

Comment by: plazma247 (May 10, 2008 17:37)

lol how did I know a thread on the PS3 doing a doo-dee on a 360 would already be equivilent of war and peace in length and have some firey words contained withing... lol

Anyway im glad for sony that their vision and long term market tactics paid divident to microsofts lets just get it out there first approach ...

There is something microsoft is winning in.. dead units.. im sure the early release with a system that has been frought with design problems has seen the red ring of death possibly costing microsoft the long term game.

Zippy there is some figures i would like to publically see, the number of units returned for both manufactures which really gives you a good impression of the design and quality of the products forgetting the technical specs, graphics and everything else that is diffirent between them.

Comment by: TrinUK (May 12, 2008 10:09)

There is something alot of people are missing here. Sony have had very little faulty units returned where as Microsoft have had many. When my first XBox 360 died, it was trashed and I was reimbursed in full by my insurance cover to buy a new unit which i did. This was before Microsoft announced the 3 year extended warranty. My new 360 counts as a "New Sale".

How many people out there have done the same? or just simply gone out and bought another unit? eg, 360 Basic users bought Premium units. Premium users upgrade to the Elite units. Now remove the number of replaced/faulty units by sales and Microsofts figures will fall drastically.

Most people won't touch the 360 Basic and most likely the Premium either due to the RROD. To date my PS3 hasn't given any trouble where as my upgraded 360 Premium is giving problems with the video port causing the system to reset. I am a console collector (Neo Geo AVS is my favourite) so im not bias. The truth from owning both systems is that the PS3 overall is a better machine. It feels grown up, classy, professional and runs great - it seems more than just a games machine, a box of dark secrets. The 360 is fantastic, slightly better crisp graphics, good menus and does what it says on the tin (its a games console). It's just a shame the reliabilty lets it down in a big way. Saying that.... I would buy another 360 and future MS consoles because the 360 is very good indeed. I'm proud to own both!

Comment by: MonoSoft (May 19, 2008 20:29)

excellent, couldn't be happier that Sony overtook XBox 360 in Europe...

which person above believed the rumours of the Blu-Ray XBox 360?! Blu-Ray is a Sony Format... and they're in close competition (from Sony's Point of View atleast).

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There is something alot of people are missing here. Sony have had very little faulty units returned where as Microsoft have had many. When my first XBox 360 died, it was trashed and I was reimbursed in full by my insurance cover to buy a new unit which i did. This was before Microsoft announced the 3 year extended warranty. My new 360 counts as a "New Sale".

How many people out there have done the same? or just simply gone out and bought another unit? eg, 360 Basic users bought Premium units. Premium users upgrade to the Elite units. Now remove the number of replaced/faulty units by sales and Microsofts figures will fall drastically.

Most people won't touch the 360 Basic and most likely the Premium either due to the RROD. To date my PS3 hasn't given any trouble where as my upgraded 360 Premium is giving problems with the video port causing the system to reset. I am a console collector (Neo Geo AVS is my favourite) so im not bias. The truth from owning both systems is that the PS3 overall is a better machine. It feels grown up, classy, professional and runs great - it seems more than just a games machine, a box of dark secrets. The 360 is fantastic, slightly better crisp graphics, good menus and does what it says on the tin (its a games console). It's just a shame the reliabilty lets it down in a big way. Saying that.... I would buy another 360 and future MS consoles because the 360 is very good indeed. I'm proud to own both!

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one of the most realistic statements said so far.. ^_^

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Most people won't touch the 360 Basic and most likely the Premium either due to the RROD.

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the worst case of malfunction, even has a worldwide nickname for god's sake!

nevertheless, i think i'd be happy to see either of these two consoles beat Wii, as much as that's never going to happen -weep-

Comment by: nobrainer (May 20, 2008 07:21)

@ MonoSoft

the spin talkers (public relations) from either sony or m$ will never mention the wii because its continually wiping the floor with both the 360 and the ps3.

in this generation most ppl own pc's that can play most games so both the 360 and ps3 are a bit meh as they are just more of the same games as the ps2 and xbox, with improved effects, a big WOW as graphics are what makes a game, right? and most of these titles you can get for a pc at a lower cost with a better frame rate, resolution and FREE publicly made mods.

then the wii has been made to engage the whole family, with fun gaming using an innovative control system, not the lone teenager sat in a dark bedroom all day and the wii is outselling all so the battle is on to see who can be in the 3rd spot after both the wii and ds is on.


Nintendo Wii outsells 360, PS3, PS2, PSP combined in April

Originally posted by hyper:

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Surprising absolutely no one, Nintendo took the number one and two slots in hardware sales. The Wii sold 714,200 units while the Nintendo DS moved 414,800 units (third place sales go to the PSP with 192,700 units). This month the Wii outsold the Playstation 2, PlayStation 3, PSP, and Xbox 360... combined.

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Comment by: varnull (May 20, 2008 07:47)

But what did we expect from 'tendo? They pretty much invented this type of gaming. Combine that with their proven build quality (my original brick nes is still going strong) innovations in controls, wide range of different type games and how can they fail? Oh.. I forgot.. It's the cheapest as well.

As for failure rates.. lets think back..

the 360 is badly designed.. it's a nightmare, so much so that a senior member of M$ console division was very interested in the possibility of liquid cooling the damn thing. Turns out that was too expensive, and the actual fault seems to lie elsewhere.
Now the ps3 was delayed and delayed.. firstly because the blu drive refused to work reliably.. and then 3 months more for unspecified reasons. they probably had brick issues as well but seem to have solved them. As sony are actually a hardware manufacturer they have a little bit of an upper hand here.. They can go into their works and find out exactly what is wrong.. M$ are using general assembly plants in the far east where they don't seem to have that kind of control.
Tendo take (as always) path 3.. KISS.. lower spec hardware, less heat and tried and tested technology.. Bonus.. reliability and lower price.

I wouldn't tell anybody to buy a 360. They should have sorted these problems by now, but they keep messing with the design instead of getting the damn thing working properly in the first place. Like with fista.. M$ seem to have lost the plot. It must be greed. Ha!

Free open source software = made by end users who want an application to work.... #1 image again.. check it out ;)

Comment by: Zygfryd (May 21, 2008 14:51)

Originally posted by varnull:

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according to figures released by Sony.

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hahahahaha.. I have sold more Gary Glitter cd's in Europe this year than sony have.. according to figures released by varnull !!!

Talk about spin and BS. I have yet to meet a ps3 owner in the flesh and know 9 360 owners.. locally it's not true.

Yet more non-news from the sony camp..

I call shenanagins !!

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I know two owners of PS3 in my building (Poland), one of them have 360 or maybe i should say have third 360, one of which died on our eyes (there was also third buddy, we came to see his new lcd - we don't visit him too often mind you, so this was fu... coincidence).

After that i realy re-consider buying 360 which i've planned but its so unreliable - thats why that friend bought GTAIV for PS3, not for 360 and i think many people with both consoles and bad experiences did the same... especially in Europe.

PS. Sorry for my english ;)

Comment by: MonoSoft (May 22, 2008 22:35)

@Nobrainer

that is true, in many respects, but for a computer to reach these "higher" potentials above PS3 and Xbox 360 would cost almost twice a PS3... i suppose it comes down to how seriously people take their gaming... i know Wii wipes the floor with both of them, but i would like to see one of the two beat the Wii in atleast one continent, i wouldn't be surprised at all if the PS3 beat the Wii in Europe in a few years, im not saying either will win, as the Wii has already sold 1 and a half times (30 million) it's predessesor (Gamecube). I'll still be surprised if the Wii can outsell the PS2, selling 130 million (atleast) and still selling up to this date..

It's obvious i find the PS3 the best of the three, but that's only my opinion.. people can't use "sales" to boost their own opinion of a console, because it doesn't matter what everyone else thinks of that game console in your living/bed room, it matters what you think...

PC can't really come into this, as it serves too many functions to imagine, the majority not being a gaming console.

fair debait though.. gaming wouldn't be the same if everyone liked the same thing.. ^_^

PSP, Custom: Crystal Faceplate and UMD Door, Black Backplate
MotherBoard = TA-086 MB(25/12/2005)3.80 M33-5