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Comment by: nobrainer (Apr 21, 2008 06:05)

Originally posted by Dela:

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firstly, both companies want YOUR money equally, neither is more greedy and Sony didn't put rootkits on your damn CDs (Sony BMG did) and if they did, what the f**k would that have to do with gaming anyway?

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what about sonys game DRM, secuROM, with the same phone home abilities of their infamous anti-consumer rootkit and bd+?

then you have, ARccOS, aacs, bd+, ATRAC, ect, sony has its figures in many forms of drm as does m$, what sony(mpaa) are trying to do is close the analogue hole and force everyone to upgrade to the crippled by drm hdmi (hdcp) connections.

all companies do want you money but its about time at least one company was pro-consumer and stopped ripping off ppl, especially global price fixing in the UK, the "they do it also" argument is best left in the playground where it belongs as anti-consumer is just anti-consumer and needs to be boycotted.

and for gaming divisions they need to stop anti-consumer licensing, especially on new titles, where you do not own the game only the right to play it, you cannot sell, lend or even give it away (psn warhawk (please post other titles ppl should boycott for being anti-consumer)) thus destroying the second-hand market and generating more revenue. then you have the introduction of charging for what has always been user generated free content, extra maps, weapons, vehicles ect, which now has been turned into a money generating exercise because if ppl are playing free content they are not needing to purchase new titles!

these matters need to be addressed by all manufacturers before the consumer loses out completely.

Comment by: Oner (Apr 21, 2008 12:11)

Edited. Why should I bother? I'll just be wasting my time & effort....Hey Dela, you are absolutely 100% right about fanboys though. Your point about

Quote:

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""Sony is an evil corporation that put rootkits on your legally-bought music CDs".....Sony didn't put rootkits on your damn CDs (Sony BMG did)"

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It seems all some people do is harp on something that has no bearings anymore and or try and mix one thing with another just to rant while totally disregard & overlooking (even understanding) a valid point. I guess Sony (as stated) is a big bad company for wanting/trying to protect their intellectual property from being illegally distributed. Who would of thought?

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Comment by: ZippyDSM (Apr 21, 2008 17:00)

Oner

Quote:

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1) PS1 was CD based for games and audio and for their innovative 3D gaming (remember how Battle Arena Toshinden offered something NO other fighter did ~ the ability to MOVE out of the way from an attack)

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uummm....Virtua fighter for the Saturn and some SNK 2D fighters had back and foregrounds.

the PS3 has downgraded BWC losing about 20-30% of the its compatibly,this is unforgivable for something over 300$....
Also the PS3 is a bit backward in its media options I know mroe than 3 people wo have to unplug their audio hookups and change them to another one to get some or full sound in movies, that needs to be polished up.

lawndog
innovation at its best has load of intuitiveness...the WII dose not have intuitive button customization the games tend to be forgettable party or gimmick crap for party time,not "real" games.

Of corse looking at control over the control no console gives you the options a PC dose...and I think this is something consoles need badly I need customized layouts because I am a nut job,I am learning disabled and my mind dose not work like others,ad in others with disablitrys its time gaming offered some disabled controllers,left right handed controllers and full button/stick/movement configurations in the system. Now the pads and control systems can be extra charge 100 a pop for them for all I care,I just need full button mapping on 80% of my games so I wont start enjoying them when I get tired of them 3 months after I beat it.


the 360 and PS3 go about different ways to fill the media and high end console gaming niche, my main complaint on the 360 is iffy hardware and locked data/HDD this had lead me to just get away from it every time I have had it or had the change to get it cheap,(it helps that only 3 or 4 of tis games are not on PC too :P)

the PS3 annoyes me I wanted full BWC they gave us sht and chips with only more chips than the 360s laughable BWC setup,add up the delay in momentum from the bad launch and the slow go on momentum due to optimizations, I can wait its going to take a couple of years before the PS3 will shine and when it dose it should out pace the aging and decripted 360 nicely.

The WII is a casual console more so than before it,in fact I would say its as simple as the pre 8bit Atari systems only with motion control better graphics and a tiny handful of real games, party and gimmick games should not be priced over 20$ because they are every bit as disposable as the casual mentality.

In the end a WII and 360 or PS3 will be a great game balance have them all for full gaming bliss.
=======================================
nobrainer
Use crazies and some sane members are working on a gamers bill of rights.
http://forums.theeca.com/showthread.php?p=76353#post76353

DRM bad,tradeabilty and sell of DLC good notto mention "traceability" of what you bought so you don;t have to rebuy it.

Come over to the eca forms we need another staunch consumer rights troll,I is notz hairy enough *lick* =^^=

=============================================================
Oner
I am sorry there is a line a company dose not cross when "protecting" itself and sony have crossed that line for than 5 times and MS has done it at least twice.

Never forget and only forgive when its cheap and not so offensive.

Comment by: goodswipe (Apr 21, 2008 17:47)

Originally posted by nexgen:

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To say that Wii reach to a larger fan base is totally ridiculous.

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How is that totally ridiculous? You won't catch an 80 year old woman playing something on a 360 or PS3.

Originally posted by nexgen:

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Its Nintendo & there nothing new from them that we having seen in the past.

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Nothing new from Nintendo? You are kidding right? LOL...J/K? With the Wii, they have totally changed the way you and I play video games. How have they not been nothing but innovative here?

Originally posted by nexgen:

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Everyone i know that own a Wii has been burnout & said its short term fun plus lets not for get the sub-par games they have out.My son has a Wii so i should know but i have played it for no more than 30min & its all hype,but we all know why its selling PRICE POINT.If Sony would have launched the PS3 at that price point you wouldn't be hearing anything about Wii.I don't like Microsoft but i can say that they don't have a very good gaming library unlike Wii Playing Rehashes of Mario the last 15 years does get boring.

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Yea sure, ok. If everyone feels that way, why do they continue to take the lead in sales? And it's next to impossible to find these things in the store without launching an all out operation to find one.

If Sony had launched their player at the price point the Wii is at, yea, people would definitely be buying those up. They would be buying them instead of paying 400-500 for a Blu-ray player.

"look honey, it said goodswipe! oh wow, that's amazing."

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Apr 21, 2008 17:51)

Originally posted by goodswipe:

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Originally posted by nexgen:

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To say that Wii reach to a larger fan base is totally ridiculous.

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How is that totally ridiculous? You won't catch an 80 year old woman, playing something on a 360 or PS3.

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Even a idiot(mew) understand the WIIs reach into the causal market and beyond is awesome and frighting.

Comment by: goodswipe (Apr 21, 2008 17:59)

Exactly...

I'm not trying to sound like some crazy fanboy or anything, hell I like playing all the consoles. It just amazes me how blind some people can be. Arguing that the Wii isn't innovative is like trying to argue that alternative fuels are not good for us.

"look honey, it said goodswipe! oh wow, that's amazing."

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Apr 21, 2008 18:03)

Originally posted by goodswipe:

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Exactly...

I'm not trying to sound like some crazy fanboy or anything, hell I like playing all the consoles. It just amazes me how blind some people can be. Arguing that the Wii isn't innovative is like trying to argue that alternative fuels are not good for us.

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Quote:

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innovative
A adjective
1 innovative, innovational, groundbreaking
being or producing something like nothing done or experienced or created before; "stylistically innovative works"; "innovative members of the artistic community"; "a mind so innovational, so original"

2 advanced, forward-looking, innovative, modern
ahead of the times; "the advanced teaching methods"; "had advanced views on the subject"; "a forward-looking corporation"; "is British industry innovative enough?"

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Interesting the PS3 could be considered innovative as well, and the way its made I could agree to that.

The WII is bucking 2 of the main mainstream trends in gaming(media and ultra slick fancy grphics), and making a fortune at it while doing something with new with controls.

I have 2 problems with the WII it needs more real games and I would kill for full button mapping.

Comment by: goodswipe (Apr 21, 2008 18:09)

Quote:

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I have 2 problems with the WII it needs more real games and I would kill for full button mapping.

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Yea, I agree with you there. More games would be nice, but it seems to be working for some people. Like I've said before, I think the people that buy the Wii are probably not your every day hardcore gamer. And the hardcore gamers that do own it, don't mind because they get their fix with the other consoles they own.

"look honey, it said goodswipe! oh wow, that's amazing."

Comment by: nobrainer (Apr 21, 2008 18:11)

I've just played mariocart wii, i i've got to say its the best driving game to play with family/friends by far, its fun not graphics and this is why the wii (& DS) continues to outsell everything.

one great idea by nintendo is the loyalty rewards, the other manufacturers would be wise to adopt a similar system.

when you purchase a nintendo game/hardware you can register it at nintendo and receive loyalty "stars" which can then be converted to money you are able to spend on any downloadable games/content. +1 for nintendo and the pro consumer marketing, instead of just trawling and selling your data and giving customers 0 reward.

@ ZippyDSM

i fully agree with the wii as second, but only to a pc dude as consoles still don't do uber visuals yet but what do you expect from vga cards that are 3 years old+. serious gamers own pc's ppl on tight incomes or little ability to read instructions choose a console for the plug and play.

Comment by: NexGen76 (Apr 21, 2008 23:26)

Originally posted by goodswipe :

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How is that totally ridiculous? You won't catch an 80 year old woman playing something on a 360 or PS3.

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Okay this was the most over hyped story i have seen...There was some nursing homes that use it as a tool for working out but it has been proved that the Wii does no more working out than just simply walking.I don't call reaching out to a few nursing homes reaching massive fan base which Nintendo hasn't.They have yet to reach out to 360 & PS3 die hard fan base which is going to be very hard if more than half your games are kiddie ish.


Does Wii Fit make you fit? Well its creator, Shigeru Miyamoto, has argued that the purpose of the game is not to make you fit but to "make you aware of your body."

http://www.officialnintendomagazine.co.uk/article.php?id=3231

Originally posted by goodswipe :

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Nothing new from Nintendo? You are kidding right? LOL...J/K? With the Wii, they have totally changed the way you and I play video games. How have they not been nothing but innovative here?

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It just this depend on what age group you are(showing my age lol)motion sensing isn't new it very old actually.This has been tried by Nintendo already.Nintendo power glove which use the same concept but different tech.Watch the video & tell me how the Wii is so ground breaking?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93iDhnBcMGo&NR=1

Originally posted by goodswipe :

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Yea sure, ok. If everyone feels that way, why do they continue to take the lead in sales?

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Originally posted by Mike Capps:

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As for why he believes the Wii has become so popular, he says it’s like a virus that just keeps spreading:

It’s a virus where you buy it and you play it with your friends and they’re like, “Oh my God that’s so cool, I’m gonna go buy it.” So you stop playing it after two months, but they buy it and they stop playing it after two months but they’ve showed it to someone else who then go out and buy it and so on. Everyone I know bought one and nobody turns it on. Obviously there’s a class of people who really love it and enjoy it and are getting into the games but I’m still waiting for that one game that makes me play it.

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F.Y.I.

New Wii Games Find a Big (but Stingy) Audience

Nintendo sits atop the home video-game market. Its Wii, though less technologically advanced than Microsoft’s Xbox 360 or Sony’s PlayStation 3, continues to outsell those machines and is now in more than 20 million homes.

The Wii’s reach extends far, including use for physical therapy.

So why are retailers having so much trouble selling Wii games?

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/21/techno...Hxg&oref=slogin

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Apr 22, 2008 00:40)

NexGen76
miss point much?the WII is selling 2 or 3 to 1,the WII has found a wider audience, however they might not mindlessly buy into industry hype like the hardcore gamers (I wouldn't call anything mainstream hardcore...) hardcore gamers know games,fancore gamers know brains and lust after hype and mindless crap to keep the industry "safe" in its mediocrity.

The WII might not have as great game sales but has made up thos profits in unit sales, hate the wii being last gen all you want hate the wii for begin more casuals focused than the other systems and trashing them at that game.

At least admit why you hate them and not try to be snobbish and hide behind convoluted reasons,come out and say it let go of the elite within you....just don't become like me a freaking game nazi ><

Comment by: oofRome (Apr 22, 2008 01:04)

I joined this discussion pretty late, so I apologize in advance if anything I say is redundant.

Originally posted by Oner:

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cons1=PS2®1=All&cons2=PS3®2=All&cons3=X360®3=All&weeks=400
The bottom line is this and will always be this. Sony has a MUCH better worldwide market penetration with PS1 & PS2 sales while Microsoft with the Xbox did not and currently with the 360 will not, in the end. The Xbox had sold roughly 28 Million with the US being their best market, so this combined with the 360's poor sales in all other markets & hardware issues shows what the trend for the 360 will be. I could go on but I think the gist of my point had been made.

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I agree. Only a fool would argue the lack of 360's market penetration compared to ps2. Hell, only the ps1 could hold a candle to the ps2. Microsoft's market penetration, however, has improved from the xbox.

Quote:

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As for the Wii, it will continue to sell well because of Nintendo's history, quality of product, price point and again their worldwide presence (plus it is for kids, more so than the other 2 and parents will be inclined towards that).

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But it isn't just Nintendo's history that is selling the product. It's the product itself. You can't explain the Wii and DS' selling numbers simply by "Nintendo has always made fun, quality products". Nintendo put forward a couple innovative products, and had a marketing plan to compliment both. Nintendo's market presence was no doubt important, but so was the product itself.

Quote:

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In addition it should be noted that the 360's sales has flattened quite a bit while the PS3 has shown a similar sales trend compared to the PS2. Because of this the PS3 will continue to close the gap and then SHOULD surpass the 360 in sales by later this year if not by sometime in early 09 at the latest.

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Perhaps, but the historical differences between when the ps2/ps3 selling years are much more profound; particularly the competition in relation to Sony, and developer support.
Now there is little doubt in my mind that the ps3 will be a successful system, but to say that it will have the success of it's predecessors based solely on similarities in a historical chart is a little naive.
The ps3 does not enjoy the same market share in comparison to the competition as the ps2 did, and thus will not garner the software support. And while it is a monster piece of hardware, the software determines the success of a system. That I can say with historical certainty.

Comment by: nobrainer (Apr 22, 2008 07:20)

Originally posted by oofRome:

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The ps3 does not enjoy the same market share in comparison to the competition as the ps2 did, and thus will not garner the software support. And while it is a monster piece of hardware, the software determines the success of a system. That I can say with historical certainty.

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the ps2 had no competition, virtually every game released was for the ps2 which is why its the best console to date. game sales are what count is in house usually suck its the 3rd party developers than can make/break hardware as sega found out with the more technically advanced offering, the dreamcast.

this is why the worst thing that sony did was can backwards compatibility in the UK but if ppl are playing them old ps2 titles they aren't purchasing the lame launch line up.

seems the 360 is now several years old its doing a fine job of keeping up with the new player on the block, the ps3

Originally posted by myself:

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chart linked via arstechnica:



http://www.mcvuk.com/interviews/230/UK-March-Charts-Analysis

Originally posted by link:

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UK March Charts - Analysis Courtesy of ChartTrack and ELSPA

ALL FORMATS TOP 50: MARCH
1. Mario & Sonic and the Olympic Games (Wii, DS) Sega
2. Tom Clancy’s Rainbow Six: Vegas 2 (360, PS3) Ubisoft
3. Dr. Kawashima’s Brain Training (DS) Nintendo
4. Army of Two (360, PS3) EA
5. Gran Turismo 5 (PS3) SCE
6. Call of Duty 4: Modern Warfare (PS3, Xbox 360, PC, DS) Activision
7. Pro Evolution Soccer 2008 (Xbox 360, PS3, PS2, Wii, PSP, DS, PC ) Konami
8. Guitar Hero III: Legends of Rock (Xbox 360, PS2, Wii, PS3, PC) Activision
9. Carnival: Funfair Games (Wii) Take Two
10. Bully: Scholarship Edition (Xbox 360, Wii) Rockstar
11. FIFA ’08 (PS3, Xbox 360, PS2, PSP, Wii, DS, PC) EA
12. Frontlines: Fuel of War (Xbox 360, PC) THQ
13. Cooking Mama 2 (DS) 505 Games
14. Game Party (Wii) Midway
15. More Brain Training (DS) Nintendo
16. Lost: The Videogame (Xbox 360, PS3, PC) Ubisoft
17. Wii Play (Wii) Nintendo
18. Lost Odyssey (Xbox 360) Microsoft
19. FIFA Street 3 (Xbox 360, PS3, DS) EA
20. Ratatouille (Wii, DS, PS2, PSP, PS3, Xbox 360, PC) THQ


OTAL SOFTWARE BY LABEL (units)

Nintendo - 10.4%
Sega - 9.5%
EA Games - 8.9%
THQ - 6.6%
SCE - 5%
Ubisoft - 4.9%
Microsoft - 3.8%
Red Storm - 3.7%
Activision - 3.6%
EA Sports - 2.9%

TOTAL SOFTWARE BY LABEL (value)

Sega - 10.7%
EA Games - 10.1%
Nintendo - 9.5%
Microsoft - 7.2%
THQ - 6.3%
Red Storm - 5.7%
Ubisoft - 4.4%
SCE - 4.4%
Activision - 4.2%

FULL PRICE FORMAT SHARE (units)

Xbox 360 - 23.1%
Wii - 18.5%
PC - 17.1%
DS - 16.7%
PS3 - 16.4%
PSP - 4.2%
PS2 - 3.8%
Apple Mac - 0.2%

FULL PRICE FORMATS SHARE (value)

Xbox 360 - 25.6%
Wii - 18.5%
PC - 18.5%
PS3 - 18.3%
DS - 12.9%
PS2 - 2.7%
PSP - 3%
Apple Mac - 0.5%

BUDGET FORMAT SHARE (units)

DS - 30.6%
PC - 21%
Wii - 16.7%
PS2 - 12.3%
PSP - 7.3%
Xbox 360 - 6.2%
PS3 - 5.6%
Others - 0.3%

BUDGET FORMAT SHARE (value)

DS - 35.9%
Wii - 19.4%
PC - 11.4%
PS2 - 11.6%
PS3 - 7.5%
Xbox 360 - 7.2%
PSP - 6.8%
Others - 0.1%

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quote take from ere! http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/654283#3978457

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Apr 22, 2008 07:50)

nobrainer
dev power and BWC rules,however the 360 can not get most of the Asian devs to sign on,this cripples them on a world wide basis,sure they will maintain a bit sine they were the only thing going but they could can not maintain that momentum with Asian based competition in full swing.

In some instances the 360 is much like the PS2, however its fatal flaw is lack of Asian market interest and this will keep it from gaining global dominance.

the PS3 has issues but no less than the 360 IMO, all the PS3 needs to gain the future is Asian dev support and some US/UK dev support it will become like the PS2 in time due to that.

the will fade due to issues on all fronts.

Comment by: goodswipe (Apr 22, 2008 14:37)

Quote:

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It just this depend on what age group you are(showing my age lol)motion sensing isn't new it very old actually.This has been tried by Nintendo already.Nintendo power glove which use the same concept but different tech.Watch the video & tell me how the Wii is so ground breaking?

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Oh trust me, I was around for the Power Glove and the Power Pad and all those other things Nintendo has come out with in the past.

Quote:

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Does Wii Fit make you fit? Well its creator, Shigeru Miyamoto, has argued that the purpose of the game is not to make you fit but to "make you aware of your body."

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I never said anything about the Wii Fit. You can lose some weight with the Wii, just depends on how you use it. Hell you can go to the gym everyday and not lost weight or gain muscle, just depends on how you work out.

http://www.engadget.com/2007/01/18/wii-s...ds-nine-pounds/
http://www.gamespot.com/news/6166231.html

There are countless other sites out there that you can read about with just a simple Google search.

I can go on and on with this one, but I'm going to shut up - LOL!

"look honey, it said goodswipe! oh wow, that's amazing."

Comment by: varnull (Apr 22, 2008 14:50)

If anybosy still has one.. There is a motion sensing pad (looking very much like an xbox pad) video demo on the Windoes98 disk.

It's in the extra content from the disk boot menu. Nothing new under the sun.

Free open source software = made by end users who want an application to work....

Comment by: SProdigy (Apr 22, 2008 18:06)

My fiance works at a nursing home that indeed has a Wii hooked up to one of their television sets. Her grandmother was over our place one day with a bunch of the family and we were trying Wii Sports out. She was interested in trying and it took all of 2 minutes to pick up a controller and learn how to play. Though screaming for button mapping might be useful for some games, alot of Wii games don't use a button for alot of the action (No More Heroes, Red Steel, Zelda, Mario Galaxy, etc.) and use motion controls. Heck, even Mario Kart allows you to use the Wiimote like a wheel, Wiimote plus nunchuk, Classic Controller or Gamecube controller to play the game! How much more customization could you want?

In a completely seperate rant, I read online that a new game engine could crank out better visuals on the Wii. I dare say some games like Mario Kart look very sharp while most of the ports (like Madden) look more like crap than others. I know the Wii only does 480p, and those of us with HDTV's see a bit of degradation in the graphics, but overall alot of people don't notice a difference (see any Blu-Ray vs. SD-DVD argument, er, discussion on AD.)

http://www.videogamer.com/news/21-04-2008-8085.html

As for the Sega quotes, that's interesting stuff that I would have to research. I definitely know that Sony was on tap for the SNES CD drive that was vaporware. That has been documented. As for the Dreamcast, it died because of lack of support. Capcom and Midway had Sega's back, but EA's lack of support (no DC Madden title) pretty much sealed the deal. Of course there was NFL 2K, but Madden "NFL" football was exclusive to PSX for awhile there. (Anyone remember Madden 64 with the fake teams?) As for Sega helping dev the Xbox, that would be interesting, but not farfetched, as the online components of the Dreamcast ran on Windows CE, the mobile version of Microsoft's operating system, at that time.

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Apr 22, 2008 18:21)

Originally posted by SProdigy:

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My fiance works at a nursing home that indeed has a Wii hooked up to one of their television sets. Her grandmother was over our place one day with a bunch of the family and we were trying Wii Sports out. She was interested in trying and it took all of 2 minutes to pick up a controller and learn how to play. Though screaming for button mapping might be useful for some games, alot of Wii games don't use a button for alot of the action (No More Heroes, Red Steel, Zelda, Mario Galaxy, etc.) and use motion controls. Heck, even Mario Kart allows you to use the Wiimote like a wheel, Wiimote plus nunchuk, Classic Controller or Gamecube controller to play the game! How much more customization could you want?

In a completely seperate rant, I read online that a new game engine could crank out better visuals on the Wii. I dare say some games like Mario Kart look very sharp while most of the ports (like Madden) look more like crap than others. I know the Wii only does 480p, and those of us with HDTV's see a bit of degradation in the graphics, but overall alot of people don't notice a difference (see any Blu-Ray vs. SD-DVD argument, er, discussion on AD.)

http://www.videogamer.com/news/21-04-2008-8085.html

As for the Sega quotes, that's interesting stuff that I would have to research. I definitely know that Sony was on tap for the SNES CD drive that was vaporware. That has been documented. As for the Dreamcast, it died because of lack of support. Capcom and Midway had Sega's back, but EA's lack of support (no DC Madden title) pretty much sealed the deal. Of course there was NFL 2K, but Madden "NFL" football was exclusive to PSX for awhile there. (Anyone remember Madden 64 with the fake teams?) As for Sega helping dev the Xbox, that would be interesting, but not farfetched, as the online components of the Dreamcast ran on Windows CE, the mobile version of Microsoft's operating system, at that time.

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FYI I be a pirate game nazi AARRRRR *mutters something in German harshly*, my point for Control over the control goes outside of casuals and into hard core and people that comprehend menus and button mapping who want the best from a game.

"I read online that a new game engine could crank out better visuals on the Wii."
Ya the game is called conduit I believe,from what I have seen the WII can do great graphics when you have a coherent and good staff building the game, but for me I could care less, I want to be able to play and enjoy a game thats not watered down for the mindless masses and if you do water it down for the zombie horde have the foresight to put in a real gamer mode......

varnull
motion sensing has been out for 10ish years maybe? but no one has tried to take it to this level,however the things people take for granted like button mapping to me if it was default for 90% of games that would be more innovative and forward thinking in my fuzzy half wit line of thinking..

Comment by: lawndog (Apr 22, 2008 20:11)

ok yes I did forget about the power glove, it worked on what, about 10-20 games? for the wii to make motion sensor for almost every game supplied to the wii is innovative.
kind of like the whole online gaming thing, I've been playing games online since the early nineties, yes the real-time make a move every three hours type of games yes that's considered online gameing, but does not compare to whats out today.
but nobody has taken it to the mass's like sony, microsoft, and pc.

Comment by: Mr-Movies (Apr 24, 2008 03:36)

Online gaming has been around since BBS's, before Al Gore created the WEB (too funny), were popular and some were action type games. Now the graphics were not fantastic but they weren't bad either so as to online gaming definately nothing new just more popular now then ever before.

I'm with you Zippy there are some games it would really be nice to remap your controller for, why is it these days that the programmers know what works better for you then you do? That seems to be the trend these days and even with PC games were they have decided that only a mouse can be used, sure you might be able to remap to a wheel or joystick/pad but they expect the mouse so the game play doesn't work proper if you remap.

This is really funny because most of the people on this forum was saying that Wii would never take off or be sucessful prior to its release. The graphics were horrible, there were not any good games and so on.... Now we see the Wii kicking as... I just have to chuckle as it is just one more example of the masses being way off base once again.

Say, if Sony is working on a PS4 now maybe we will see it in the next 8 years or so. LOL Will they use a DVD-HD instead of the BD player? Or maybe they could goto that tripple layer DVD that would be smart!

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Apr 24, 2008 03:53)

Originally posted by Mr-Movies:

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Online gaming has been around since BBS's, before Al Gore created the WEB (too funny), were popular and some were action type games. Now the graphics were not fantastic but they weren't bad either so as to online gaming definately nothing new just more popular now then ever before.

I'm with you Zippy there are some games it would really be nice to remap your controller for, why is it these days that the programmers know what works better for you then you do? That seems to be the trend these days and even with PC games were they have decided that only a mouse can be used, sure you might be able to remap to a wheel or joystick/pad but they expect the mouse so the game play doesn't work proper if you remap.

This is really funny because most of the people on this forum was saying that Wii would never take off or be sucessful prior to its release. The graphics were horrible, there were not any good games and so on.... Now we see the Wii kicking as... I just have to chuckle as it is just one more example of the masses being way off base once again.

Say, if Sony is working on a PS4 now maybe we will see it in the next 8 years or so. LOL Will they use a DVD-HD instead of the BD player? Or maybe they could goto that tripple layer DVD that would be smart!

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I believe the lack of control options comes from a level of arrogance,no dev time for options/polishing and a mind set that dose not have any room for such things.

Its the casual mentality of they wont use it so why do it, add to it arrogance to the point we know that is best for our game and oops we missed that by a mile but the suits wont let us fix it, there really needs to a standardized control configuration system for consoles and gaming across the board.

I love the PAD V mouse/KB nonsense it dosent matter which you use you will have people of varying levels using both/all to say mouse/KB will make you great is pathetic,I don;t understand why the hate for control over the control logic would state you finish a game you enjoy you might go out and buy another...then again MS is trying to prop up live and making shooters cumbersome and annoying to play will gaurrente a long subscription to it.

its the same for buying equipment and special power sets for MMOs if you spend 100$ in the first 3 months rushing through the game enjoying it you wont be paying the 15$ a month for 2 years grinding your soul away.

I would like to be able to buy upgrades and remove the stupid limits they set with real money and have my character start off with some fun sht not the god awful chains of of bondage MMOs start out with.

Comment by: Mr-Movies (Apr 24, 2008 12:31)

Originally posted by ZippyDSM:

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I believe the lack of control options comes from a level of arrogance,no dev time for options/polishing and a mind set that dose not have any room for such things.

Its the casual mentality of they wont use it so why do it, add to it arrogance to the point we know that is best for our game and oops we missed that by a mile but the suits wont let us fix it, there really needs to a standardized control configuration system for consoles and gaming across the board.

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You definitely could be right and as to the casual mind definitely, however as far as dev time all controller mappings are already there it really doesn’t add any time to development with exception on verifying the device mapping hooks. The size it takes is minimal at best.

With this in mind I believe the shift is due to the kid programmers that are developing the games and their personal choice for a controller(s). Most young kids I talk to like using the mouse for everything, not all of course, and scoff if I b*tch about not being able to use a game pad.

I love it when they make a racing game and the mouse is your controller with no support for a race wheel now what kind of stupidity is that, ignorance at its best. Again I know kids that like the mouse more for race games and its no wonder when you see how poor they drive.

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Apr 24, 2008 14:17)

Quote:

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Originally posted by ZippyDSM:

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I believe the lack of control options comes from a level of arrogance,no dev time for options/polishing and a mind set that dose not have any room for such things.

Its the casual mentality of they wont use it so why do it, add to it arrogance to the point we know that is best for our game and oops we missed that by a mile but the suits wont let us fix it, there really needs to a standardized control configuration system for consoles and gaming across the board.

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You definitely could be right and as to the casual mind definitely, however as far as dev time all controller mappings are already there it really doesn’t add any time to development with exception on verifying the device mapping hooks. The size it takes is minimal at best.

With this in mind I believe the shift is due to the kid programmers that are developing the games and their personal choice for a controller(s). Most young kids I talk to like using the mouse for everything, not all of course, and scoff if I b*tch about not being able to use a game pad.

I love it when they make a racing game and the mouse is your controller with no support for a race wheel now what kind of stupidity is that, ignorance at its best. Again I know kids that like the mouse more for race games and its no wonder when you see how poor they drive.

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If anything its a multi part issue, arrogance, ignorance and comprehension, that could be 4 or 9 things, its the same mentality that rapes fiction in films because they think a bad "adjusted" film will do better than a solid film based on its un bum raped fiction.

Comment by: Mr-Movies (Apr 24, 2008 21:47)

How true and sad unfortunately...

Comment by: mgnicks (May 26, 2008 22:58)

I have read a few of the posts here about the games consoles and feel that most "Hardcore Gamers" are missing the point with regards the Wii.

I have used and owned most of the following machines:

Commadore 16, 64, Amstrad 464, 6128, Amiga 500,500+, 600, 1200, Atari STe, ST fm, Acorn Electron, Vic-20, PC, Mac, Master System, Mega Drive, Saturn, Dreamcast, NES, SNES, N64, Gamecube, Wii, Gameboy, GBA, GB Colour, DS Lite, Game Gear, Lynx II, PlayStation 1, 2, Xbox, Xbox 360...

I don't think i forgot any.

The point is i feel i used to be a hardcore gamer (playing solidly for up to 72 hours at a time only pausing to go pee and perhaps eat if at a difficult part in a game.

I currently only own a Wii. Why not the other 2? Firstly the PS3 is waaaay to expensive. There is absolutely no need for a games machine to be that expensive. It's a games console after all said and done. Yeah it plays Blu-ray...and? It's the only way Sony could make sure it won. And lets face it they didn't want to waste all that money on developing it and lose out.

360? I didn't want the 360 as the games (like the other 2 really) are all the same old stuff which brings me to my point.

The biggest reason for the Wii? A change. I just wanted a change. After years and years and years of playing games (i hardly ever went out as a kid) i got fed up with playing th same old crap and some of them were indeed crap. I wanted a change. even if it meant just controlling th thing in a different way then so be it. I feel a little more immersed in my games now. More than i ever did. And so what if the games are a little kid-like? If i want real-life games (GTA IV?) then i will go outside and live one.

I like my Wii and currently am not a hardcore gamer. I now have a 2 1/2 year old who loves to play Wii Sports so thats where i am at at the moment enjoying learning him how to be a hardcore gamer. But as always each to their own. I much more prefer the platform type games anyway.