News

Comment by: TBandit (Oct 24, 2009 02:31)

Seems to me that the PS3 is starting to show its future features it came out with. I wonder how much long the 360 is going to be around for as M$ originally stopped supporting the original xbox.

Comment by: core2kid (Oct 24, 2009 02:50)

Originally posted by TBandit:

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Seems to me that the PS3 is starting to show its future features it came out with. I wonder how much long the 360 is going to be around for as M$ originally stopped supporting the original xbox.

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The original Xbox was supposidly more powerful than the PS2 yet it lasted some 4-5 years. If that's the case for the Xbox 360, next year may be it's last. PS2 on the other hand is still going after 9 years.

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Oct 24, 2009 03:03)

Quote:

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Originally posted by TBandit:

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Seems to me that the PS3 is starting to show its future features it came out with. I wonder how much long the 360 is going to be around for as M$ originally stopped supporting the original xbox.

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The original Xbox was supposidly more powerful than the PS2 yet it lasted some 4-5 years. If that's the case for the Xbox 360, next year may be it's last. PS2 on the other hand is still going after 9 years.

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It really depends on its support cycle, a console could last 10 years easily if the compensation agreed not to release theirs for 10 years. with the big 3 makers and top 5 or so software publishers its a hectic race for profit.

As for the Xbox it was more powerful but not that well supported and cost more the 360 jump started things early and made alot of headway despite all of its issues. The PS2 is still going strong(more or less) because of its install base and software support.

Due to the world financial crush I think the console makers have slowed down a tad on new console ideas, course the 360 dose kidna need a overhaul. I think a model 2 with more ram and higher CPU/GPU/bandwidth speeds as well as release games with the option of running new games in model 2 mode would make the 360 last another 5 years or at least till sony dose their new console.

All in all its going to be 3-6 years before we see a new MS/NIN/Sony console in stores.

Comment by: TBandit (Oct 24, 2009 03:27)

they updated the news by saying that M$ denies future blu ray support at gamespot

http://www.gamespot.com/news/6237577.htm...stories;title;2

i remembered reading before that they weren't going to support it in the future about a year ago

Comment by: Morreale (Oct 24, 2009 05:30)

I'm sure the next console will have Blu-Ray... If it still has DVD, well, wtf lol

Comment by: DXR88 (Oct 25, 2009 01:45)

MS wont use blue-ray they have no need to. they could resurrect HD-DVD or
design a new drive that would be consistent with DVD standards like DVD-18 or they might come out with a on the fly DVD compression mechanism.

i would like to see real 50GB games released but the reality of that ever happing is slim to none.

Comment by: DoomLight (Oct 25, 2009 04:55)

the only thing i can see from this is Msoft used BluRays for games is that the pirated games would virtually disappear. since at least for the PS3, it doesn't boot BluRays that are Burnable.

is msoft did that. no more pirated xbox games. thats the only thing i can see come from it.

Comment by: H08 (Oct 25, 2009 05:45)

Originally posted by DXR88:

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MS wont use blue-ray they have no need to. they could resurrect HD-DVD or
design a new drive that would be consistent with DVD standards like DVD-18 or they might come out with a on the fly DVD compression mechanism.

i would like to see real 50GB games released but the reality of that ever happing is slim to none.

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DVD 18 is Really Just DVD 9 With both sides of the disk being used right? I dont think people like that whole Switching sides/ or disks thing. just look at all the negative comments going to the xbox 360 version of Final Fantasy 13.

Comment by: domie (Oct 25, 2009 17:55)

HD-DVD vs Blu-ray - it ain't over for Microsoft until the fat boy sings - and the fat boy just belted out one hell of a tune - I can hear the sweat dripping from his burger fuelled obese bulk and karaoke microphone on to the stage floor from here in the UK.

Comment by: Ryu77 (Oct 29, 2009 13:07)

glassd, where are you getting this information from?

I have never heard anything about Pioneer heading the BDA. Now I know they are among the exclusive board of directors but that puts them in equal steed to Sony.

Excuse me for saying but your theory about various patents being held by numerous companies doesn't quite add up to me. It's an ultra violet (blue) laser based quite closely on the same mechanisms as DVD. How many patents can there be? One for the laser, one for the hard coating found on their discs, maybe one for the blue jewel case design... I realise there is quite possibly a few more patents based on the electronics etc. There really can't be that many for every company to hold some. I understand that to develop Blu-ray disc would have been a costly exercise with large capital needed for R & D, hence the requirement for the big guns in consumer electronics to support it, but surely they can't all hold a patent or two. There are 20 companies that sit equally among the board of directors and there are maybe a hundred more that are members/contributors.

The Blu-ray disc association was formed as a way to unify these major companies in a joint project, but at the same time keep it as a separate entity to avoid any monopolies on the market. I believe that most of the board of directors are considered equal.

Comment by: Gnawnivek (Oct 29, 2009 13:19)

I don't see how this is going to work... Well, the hardware itself is not the problem, but the recognition and consumer perception will be out of whack. The PS3 can play BD movies and games, while the BD add-on for the Xbox 360 can only do BD movies. If you look at the BD movie cases, sometimes there are tiny little stickers say "this works on PS3." It will be quite confusing if it says "PS3 and Xbox BD add-on."

Let's put it this way, any add-on for the Xbox 360 is a waste of money. You want choices? Good for you :) After my lesson with the HD-DVD add-on, yeah right, like i want another add-on (another brick on top of the HD-DVD add-on? No thanks).

Comment by: glassd (Oct 29, 2009 14:11)

Ryu77, The Blue Diode is just 1 small part of BluRay. Just having a Blue Laser does not produce picture/sound/etc… Many Companies came up with ideas/patents on the Whole of BluRay. Sony did not even develop the Blue light wave length laser nor was it their idea.(They did produce it) Information about BluRay can be found here http://www.blu-ray.com/faq/ here http://www.blu-raydisc.com/en/about/SupportingCompanies.html here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blu-ray_Disc_Association here http://www.blu-raydisc.com/assets/Downlo...02-09-16558.pdf I think Victor was Pioneer’s guy, may be wrong.

Comment by: Ryu77 (Oct 29, 2009 18:52)

Originally posted by glassd:

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Ryu77, The Blue Diode is just 1 small part of BluRay. Just having a Blue Laser does not produce picture/sound/etc… Many Companies came up with ideas/patents on the Whole of BluRay. Sony did not even develop the Blue light wave length laser nor was it their idea.(They did produce it) Information about BluRay can be found here http://www.blu-ray.com/faq/ here http://www.blu-raydisc.com/en/about/SupportingCompanies.html here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blu-ray_Disc_Association here http://www.blu-raydisc.com/assets/Downlo...02-09-16558.pdf I think Victor was Pioneer’s guy, may be wrong.

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Yes, I have google too. ;-)

Your posts make it look like Pioneer are in control Blu-ray. I have not seen any reference to this and I am sure that this is not the case.

In regards to Sony not having any input into the Blu-ray format on a technical level, this also isn't true. One reference comes to mind, which is that of AVCHD. It was Sony and Panasonic that developed this format. Blu-ray's folder structure is almost identical to that of AVCHD, apart from an increased specification and the DRM mechanisms. Blu-ray was designed from the AVCHD spec.

Comment by: glassd (Oct 29, 2009 19:25)

I was not clear with my post or you did not understand me. Pioneer, at the beginning (I think still is) of the BDA was the Chair of the BDA. Not controlling/dictating/owning, Just the head Chair. I never said that Sony did not have any technical input or even came close to saying that. Sony is one of many that gave technical input into BluRay. I assumed that you had Google but you asked where I got some of my info. I used Google too.
The purpose of all of my posts was to make the point that Sony did not invent or control BluRay. Nothing more, Nothing less. It just seams that any time BluRay is mentioned, Sony is the company that is focused on by posters.

EDIT: I went back through my post and the closest thing to confusing is when I said that the BDA was headed by Pioneer. Should have said Chaired. Sorry for all of the confusion. No mater how it is stated, Sony comes no where to Control BluRay. They are just one of many on the Board.

Comment by: Ryu77 (Oct 29, 2009 20:42)

Originally posted by glassd:

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I was not clear with my post or you did not understand me. Pioneer, at the beginning (I think still is) of the BDA was the Chair of the BDA. Not controlling/dictating/owning, Just the head Chair.

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Interesting, do you have any direct reference to this? I know they are one of the board of directors but I have never seen anything about a head chair.

Originally posted by glassd:

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I never said that Sony did not have any technical input or even came close to saying that. Sony is one of many that gave technical input into BluRay. I assumed that you had Google but you asked where I got some of my info. I used Google too.

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I thought I read somewhere that you said that... Could be wrong as it isn't there now.

Originally posted by glassd:

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The purpose of all of my posts was to make the point that Sony did not invent or control BluRay. Nothing more, Nothing less. It just seams that any time BluRay is mentioned, Sony is the company that is focused on by posters.

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Agreed, I have defended this many times myself. A big part of this is due to Sony being the most active company in the form of marketing (especially with the PS3), so consumers associate Blu-ray with Sony quite strongly. This is also why I argued the point about Pioneer being the head of BDA. I still believe (unless you can show otherwise) that they in equal position to Sony.

Originally posted by glassd:

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EDIT: I went back through my post and the closest thing to confusing is when I said that the BDA was headed by Pioneer. Should have said Chaired. Sorry for all of the confusion. No mater how it is stated, Sony comes no where to Control BluRay. They are just one of many on the Board.

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Still looks like you said head of the BDA to me, which is all I was attempting to clear up. :-)

Comment by: glassd (Oct 29, 2009 21:05)

I did say head which was wrong. I have not tried to go back and cover my tracks by editing post. It gives the time and date that a post was editid. As far as Pioneer being Lead Chair on the BDA, i can not find it but could swear that i had read that more than once. I can google it later as i am leaving work now and see if Vensent, the chairman, is from Pioneer. In an earlier post, i did say Head. May be tomorrow before Im able to search for the Chairman's (Vinsent) home company. Sorry if im wrong. Not trying to lie, just trying to prove the point that Sony is just 1 of 18 votes as far as what happens with BluRay. bff

Comment by: senator29 (Oct 29, 2009 22:05)

there is no reason a dvd-18 player could be made. one in that a head is installed on both sides of the disc so no flipping.

there are multi head designs for cdrom and dvd rom already. just no products

Comment by: KillerBug (Oct 30, 2009 08:22)

Originally posted by senator29:

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there is no reason a dvd-18 player could be made. one in that a head is installed on both sides of the disc so no flipping.

there are multi head designs for cdrom and dvd rom already. just no products

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However, that nearly doubles the number of moving parts to wear out, and it more than doubles the production cost...putting it near to the cost of making a bluray drive. On top of that, the size would be much larger, and the movies would not play on any other device!

It is downright pathetic that they refuse to release a bluray drive, the only reason for this that I can think of is Microsoft's policy of overcharching for accessories...a $100 bluray drive made by microsoft would cost $200, and you can get a decent stand-alone player for that kind of money...the only other reason that they would not offer it is customer ignorance; they are counting on customers buying a 360, with the assumption that it plays blurays...this does not work when you are selling the blu-ray addon next to it for $200, especialy when the PS3 has bluray built in for just $100 more than the cost of the add-on.

BTW...the PS2 is still going strong because of price. For $100 you can get the latest PS2 brand new, and you can get most games for $10. On top of that, there are mountains of old consoles and games, making it possible to start gaming for under $60.

Comment by: glassd (Oct 30, 2009 13:20)

Ryu77, This is not where I got my idea. I actually think that the Insider at a site quoted earlier made the statement about Pioneer’s guy being the Chairman at the BDA.

Edit to say that this is a Quote.
Quote from Article
That word came from the chairman of the BDA's U.S. promotion committee, Andy Parsons, senior vice president of product development and corporate communications at Pioneer Electronics (USA).
More info on the article. http://www.broadcastnewsroom.com/article...e.jsp?id=879885 .

Here is another Quote
Los Angeles (CA) – So the Blu-ray disc is the only physical high-definition format left in the market, but that isn’t going to translate into lower prices any time soon, according to Andy Parsons, the Chairman of the Blu-ray Disc Association. Parsons, who is also the senior VP of Advanced Product Development at Pioneer Electronics, told attendees at the DisplaySearch/NPD HDTV conference in Los Angeles that Blu-ray volume needs to increase before content makers and set-top makers can cut prices.
The rest of the article is here http://www.tgdaily.com/content/view/39347/97/

Comment by: senator29 (Oct 30, 2009 22:36)

i hate microsoft....

anyway, my reply notating the dvd-18 player was in reference to microsoft and their xbox 720 or whatever is next using a dvd format and not blueray. i don't see the need to try and "play" an xbox game in a dvd player.

so that would mean a dual sided dvd reader for a gaming machine "would" work.

and i hear you on additional parts and additional costs. but it is something that has been in the works for quite some time. since the cdrom reader has hit its limits of read speed the next step was to add heads. not 2 in the same spot but one on each end of the spindal and potentially heads on the top side of the disc. basically a simultaneous read capability in cdrom and dvdrom readers.

magnetic motion is the future and magnets would make this concept possible cheaply. hell, magnetic computing is apparently the next step. magnetic 8 bit registers, look it up.

Comment by: Ryu77 (Oct 31, 2009 20:36)

Originally posted by glassd:

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Ryu77, This is not where I got my idea. I actually think that the Insider at a site quoted earlier made the statement about Pioneer’s guy being the Chairman at the BDA.

Edit to say that this is a Quote.
Quote from Article
That word came from the chairman of the BDA's U.S. promotion committee, Andy Parsons, senior vice president of product development and corporate communications at Pioneer Electronics (USA).
More info on the article. http://www.broadcastnewsroom.com/article...e.jsp?id=879885 .

Here is another Quote
Los Angeles (CA) – So the Blu-ray disc is the only physical high-definition format left in the market, but that isn’t going to translate into lower prices any time soon, according to Andy Parsons, the Chairman of the Blu-ray Disc Association. Parsons, who is also the senior VP of Advanced Product Development at Pioneer Electronics, told attendees at the DisplaySearch/NPD HDTV conference in Los Angeles that Blu-ray volume needs to increase before content makers and set-top makers can cut prices.
The rest of the article is here http://www.tgdaily.com/content/view/39347/97/

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Thanks for the follow up.

That says to me that he is the Chairman of the "Promotions Comittee" for the BDA, so obviously not the head of the actual BDA itself. Anyway, I can see how you could have made an honest mistake.

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Nov 01, 2009 00:04)

Originally posted by senator29:

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i hate microsoft....

anyway, my reply notating the dvd-18 player was in reference to microsoft and their xbox 720 or whatever is next using a dvd format and not blueray. i don't see the need to try and "play" an xbox game in a dvd player.

so that would mean a dual sided dvd reader for a gaming machine "would" work.

and i hear you on additional parts and additional costs. but it is something that has been in the works for quite some time. since the cdrom reader has hit its limits of read speed the next step was to add heads. not 2 in the same spot but one on each end of the spindal and potentially heads on the top side of the disc. basically a simultaneous read capability in cdrom and dvdrom readers.

magnetic motion is the future and magnets would make this concept possible cheaply. hell, magnetic computing is apparently the next step. magnetic 8 bit registers, look it up.

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Well the price is about the same hardware wise say you took the basic components of a DVD DR reader and give it 2 independent lens. You have at the least 50$ worth of parts at the most 80 and that's the range of most 4X BR players. So BR will replace DVD in time and more likely flash will replace BR.

I have not seen much about magnetic motion for data storage, but unless it can rival flash in physical size,data size and speed its moot.

Comment by: glassd (Nov 02, 2009 13:30)

Ryu, here is a recent artical that calls him Chairman. http://www.reviewseeker.com/articles/lis...e=DVD-712-20-10
At this point, I would challenge you to prove me wrong by showing me an article of someone else being the Chairman and what company he is from. btw, I am not mad or trying to argue with you. This is something that i have assumed untill this point and if i am wrong, I would like someone to prove me wrong.

Comment by: glassd (Nov 02, 2009 14:33)

Ryu, I guess i should not have been searching for Chairman Andy Parsons but PRESIDENT OF THE BDA, ANDY PARSONS . Part of a quote: Andy Parsons, President of the BDA as well as a VP with Pioneer, opened the conference with a series of statistics demonstrating Blu-ray's impressive sales performance. Quote taken from http://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=2269 . I am through unless you want to send me a free movie for giving me a hard time about this. I was not mistaken thank you.
edit:spelling

Comment by: Ryu77 (Nov 03, 2009 10:35)

Originally posted by glassd:

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Ryu, I guess i should not have been searching for Chairman Andy Parsons but PRESIDENT OF THE BDA, ANDY PARSONS . Part of a quote: Andy Parsons, President of the BDA as well as a VP with Pioneer, opened the conference with a series of statistics demonstrating Blu-ray's impressive sales performance. Quote taken from http://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=2269 . I am through unless you want to send me a free movie for giving me a hard time about this. I was not mistaken thank you.
edit:spelling

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Ok, this is getting a bit silly and slightly off track. My original notion was to state that Pioneer as a "company" are not the head of the BDA. I think it is possible that Andy Parsons could have a dual role but I am sure that he treats each role with individuality. I can see that you have shown me something that I wasn't aware of with Andy Parsons being the President of the BDA. I was wrong earlier and I thank you for enlightening me. However, that was going off track from my original point, which is that I still think Sony and Pioneer as a company play an equal part in the BDA.

PS: Just to make sure that it doesn't look like I am a Sony freak, I have a $4,400 Pioneer AV Receiver (Susano Concept) and I love it!