News

Comment by: Oner (Apr 03, 2009 12:35)

Originally posted by varnull:

---

Know your history.. sega got well and truly crapped on by sony after doing 90% of the development on the ps1

---

Um...I don't know where that "information" is based off, but it is completely incorrect. The true history is that Nintendo tried to screw Sony but Sony turned it around and the Playstation was born.

Originally posted by DVDBack23:

---

sigh...I miss my Dreamcast..even the Saturn wasnt as bad as everyone made it out to be...

---

Definitely agree. I still have my launch day DC (but got rid of my Saturn after a week...still kicking myself in the ass for that one).

Originally posted by avoidz:

---

Originally posted by core2kid:

---

Originally posted by avoidz:

---

Let me know when the headline reads 'Sony cuts price of PS3'...

---

come back in 2 years, lol.

---

Thing is, you're not joking :)

---

A couple more months tops.

Search > http://forums.afterdawn.com/search
Rules > http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/2487
Important Rule > http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/380660

Comment by: varnull (Apr 03, 2009 13:04)

Unfortunately.. I have followed the history of games consoles since the Atari Jaguar XD .. unlike way to many people around here.

They fell out over the name and some part of the licensing.. resulting in the ps1 and the saturn.. instead of the one machine which should have been up against the dreamcast.

I still to this day think the saturn was the better system.

Anyway.. I have promised Andre that I won't get into any more arguments with the abusers of power on this site so that's all I'm saying.. If people can't be bothered to do some simple research into the history of the screwing over of others by their commercial sponsors then that's fair enough.

Free open source software = made by end users who want an application to work.
I would rather you hate me for who I am than love me for what I am not.
Welcome to the other side of the looking glass Alice

Comment by: Oner (Apr 03, 2009 13:13)

Looks to me like when you are proven wrong you immediately run and get on the high horse to act as if my title = abuse (as usual) trying to change the subject instead of admitting you where wrong to begin with. A simple wiki supports my truth vs consistent misinformation (not to mention nearly 30 years of gaming experience...that's before the Atari 2600) -> Proof always prevails over "words/talk"

Quote:

---

Source ~ from Wiki link provided above ;)

The first conceptions of the PlayStation date back to 1986 in Japan where it was created. Nintendo had been attempting to work with disc technology since the Famicom, but the medium had problems. Its rewritable magnetic nature could be easily erased (thus leading to a lack of durability), and the discs were a copyright infringement danger. Consequently, when details of CDROM/XA (an extension of the CD-ROM format that combines compressed audio, visual and computer data, allowing all to be accessed simultaneously) came out, Nintendo was interested. CD-ROM/XA was being simultaneously developed by Sony and Philips. Nintendo approached Sony to develop a CD-ROM add-on, tentatively titled the "SNES-CD". A contract was signed, and work began. Nintendo's choice of Sony was due to a prior dealing: Ken Kutaragi, the person who would later be dubbed "The Father of PlayStation", was the individual who had sold Nintendo on using the Sony SPC-700 processor for use as the eight-channel ADPCM sound synthesis set in the Super Famicom/SNES console through an impressive demonstration of the processor's capabilities.[12]

Sony also planned to develop another, Nintendo compatible, Sony-branded console, but one which would be more of a home entertainment system playing both Super Nintendo cartridges and a new CD format which Sony would design. This was also to be the format used in SNES-CD discs, giving a large degree of control to Sony despite Nintendo's leading position in the video gaming market.
The DualShock controller.

The SNES-CD was to be announced at the June 1991 Consumer Electronics Show (CES). However, when Hiroshi Yamauchi read the original 1988 contract between Sony and Nintendo, he realized that the earlier agreement essentially handed Sony complete control over any and all titles written on the SNES CD-ROM format. Yamauchi decided that the contract was totally unacceptable and he secretly canceled all plans for the joint Nintendo-Sony SNES CD attachment. Instead of announcing a partnership between Sony and Nintendo, at 9 a.m. the day of the CES, Nintendo chairman Howard Lincoln stepped onto the stage and revealed that Nintendo was now allied with Philips, and Nintendo was planning on abandoning all the previous work Nintendo and Sony had accomplished. Lincoln and Minoru Arakawa had, unbeknown to Sony, flown to Philips headquarters in Europe and formed an alliance of a decidedly different nature—one that would give Nintendo total control over its licenses on Philips machines.

After the collapse of the joint project, Sony considered halting their research, but ultimately the company decided to use what they had developed so far and make it into a complete, stand alone console. As a result, Nintendo filed a lawsuit claiming breach of contract and attempted, in U.S. federal court, to obtain an injunction against the release of the PlayStation, on the grounds that Nintendo owned the name. The federal judge presiding over the case denied the injunction and, in October 1991, the first incarnation of the new Sony PlayStation was revealed. However, it is theorized that only 200 or so of these machines were ever produced.
PlayStation Memory Card.

By the end of 1992, Sony and Nintendo reached a deal whereby the "Sony Play Station" would still have a port for SNES games, but Nintendo would own the rights and receive the bulk of the profits from the games, and the SNES would continue to use the Sony-designed audio chip. However, Sony decided in early 1993 to begin reworking the "Play Station" concept to target a new generation of hardware and software. As part of this process the SNES cartridge port was dropped and the space between the names was removed.

---

Search > http://forums.afterdawn.com/search
Rules > http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/2487
Important Rule > http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/380660

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Apr 03, 2009 13:28)

Originally posted by varnull:

---

Unfortunately.. I have followed the history of games consoles since the Atari Jaguar XD .. unlike way to many people around here.

They fell out over the name and some part of the licensing.. resulting in the ps1 and the saturn.. instead of the one machine which should have been up against the dreamcast.

I still to this day think the saturn was the better system.

Anyway.. I have promised Andre that I won't get into any more arguments with the abusers of power on this site so that's all I'm saying.. If people can't be bothered to do some simple research into the history of the screwing over of others by their commercial sponsors then that's fair enough.

---

I have followed gaming since the NES, with some experience with the Atari 2600, the Saturn was a nightmare more difficult to code for than the PS3, less support by sega than the PS3 by sony which meant it had a hand full of titles most of which sucked....kinda like the PS3...but I digress.

I'd say the Genisis was better even though I loveed the SNES it had cost issues and most of the titles I wanted didnt get ported over to the states...

For the 32bit Era (PSX/N64/Saturn) I'd have to side with the N64 for the first 4 years and the PSX for the rest. For the next generation of PS2/DC/GC/Xbox I'd have to side with the DC for the first couple of years by that time the PS2 was doing alot better.

The newer the console gets the less staying power it has as the industry shift to more mainstreamized influences wanking on qaulity....

Comment by: varnull (Apr 03, 2009 13:37)

*yawn* .. do you have a life?

Free open source software = made by end users who want an application to work.
I would rather you hate me for who I am than love me for what I am not.
Welcome to the other side of the looking glass Alice

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Apr 03, 2009 13:42)

Originally posted by varnull:

---

*yawn* .. do you have a life?

---

As much as you it seems.


:P

Comment by: Oner (Apr 03, 2009 13:47)

...chuckle

Search > http://forums.afterdawn.com/search
Rules > http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/2487
Important Rule > http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/380660

Comment by: lxhotboy (Apr 04, 2009 04:07)

Originally posted by varnull:

---

Unfortunately.. I have followed the history of games consoles since the Atari Jaguar XD .. unlike way to many people around here.

They fell out over the name and some part of the licensing.. resulting in the ps1 and the saturn.. instead of the one machine which should have been up against the dreamcast.

I still to this day think the saturn was the better system.

Anyway.. I have promised Andre that I won't get into any more arguments with the abusers of power on this site so that's all I'm saying.. If people can't be bothered to do some simple research into the history of the screwing over of others by their commercial sponsors then that's fair enough.

---

Oh lord you have powder milk on your breath. I have been following gaming since before the Atari 2600 as they had earlier models before its debut. You may need to follow a little closer in your history lessons in video gaming history b/c Oner is right. I thought everyone knew that Sony and Nintendo had the fallout that led to the release of the PS1 and eventually N64.

Quote:

---

The Sega Saturn, although the most technically advanced console of the generation, suffered from poor marketing and comparatively limited third-party support. Sega's decision to use dual processors was roundly criticized, and some wrongly believe the second CPU was added as a "panic" response to the PlayStation's specifications.[citation needed] Regardless of their reasons for including it, only Sega's first-party developers were ever able to use the second CPU effectively.[verification needed] The Saturn was far more difficult than the PlayStation to program for, and the 3D graphics on its 3rd party games often lacked the luster of the PlayStation or Nintendo 64 (N64), a severe disadvantage at the dawn of 3D games.

Sega was also hurt by the plan to have a surprise four-month-early US launch of their console. This head start failed for several reasons. One of the major reasons being there were few software titles ready. Also, the fact that the Sega Saturn was US$100 more costly than the PlayStation pushed many potential buyers into purchasing the cheaper PlayStation.

---

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_...fth_generation)

As far as the PS1 and Saturn, i question your memory of history again as i dont see how Saturn was any better than PS1. With the next-gen consoles of today(PS3 & Xbox360) the games look basically the same at this time. Pretty much identical from both version of recent games like Resident Evil 5. But back then their was a huge noticable diff in graphics on PS1 and saturn. Not to mention the saturn was $399 in US at launch while PS1 was $299. As everyone knows then Saturn did actually have more hardware muscle under the hood. Saturn had a V-10 and PS1 on a V-8 engine. LoL But i guess with all the bad coding for the saturn you could say the PS1 was more efficient with producing horsepower with it fuel even with a smaller engine. Also i remember a weak lineup of games for the Saturn when compared to the PS1 so as much as i respect your opinion i really think you should rethink this one. It would be best to just admit you made a bad call on this one as we all goof sometimes.

Does anyone remember coleco vision? I played Burgertime for hours back then.

Comment by: DXR88 (Apr 04, 2009 05:42)

The Saturn Was 10 times the machine Playstation ever was, when coded for properly(even Sega couldn't get it right, and they built the dame thing)it was years ahead of its time(PS3 anyone)Sega shot themselves in the foot at the same time by locking the second core to first party developers leaving 3rd party devs with blocky looking games (Virtual fighter anyone).

anyhow the more i think about it the more the PS3 reminds me of the Saturn.

the most of us knew the DreamCast was going to be short lived when the PS2 hit the stores. Sega had made major mistakes mostly on the consumer end which lost them a sizable fanbase they gathered from the Geneses/x32 SegaCD. so when dreamcast came around only the diehard fans where intersted.

the Saturn was there undoing, and a bad release date for the dreamcast was the final nail in there coffin.

Comment by: leady (Apr 04, 2009 08:21)

a lot of stores have already sold this machine for 100.....months ago

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Apr 04, 2009 10:36)

Originally posted by DXR88:

---

The Saturn Was 10 times the machine Playstation ever was, when coded for properly(even Sega couldn't get it right, and they built the dame thing)it was years ahead of its time(PS3 anyone)Sega shot themselves in the foot at the same time by locking the second core to first party developers leaving 3rd party devs with blocky looking games (Virtual fighter anyone).

anyhow the more i think about it the more the PS3 reminds me of the Saturn.

the most of us knew the DreamCast was going to be short lived when the PS2 hit the stores. Sega had made major mistakes mostly on the consumer end which lost them a sizable fanbase they gathered from the Geneses/x32 SegaCD. so when dreamcast came around only the diehard fans where intersted.

the Saturn was there undoing, and a bad release date for the dreamcast was the final nail in there coffin.

---

Sega spent to much money on hardware, the DC was perfect in many ways but due to their previous losses they decided to pull out, the DC was making money but akin to the Xbox Sega didn't have the money for full production+debt aired from the Saturn and other bad decisions, unlike MS how has more money than bwainz 0-o.

Hell the DC was supported in Japan even making new units for about 5 or so years after they pulled it from the international market. Even a few games were made for it in that time frame.

The 32X and the bad mistakes with the Saturn is what did the most damage to them.

Comment by: Oner (Apr 04, 2009 13:50)

Originally posted by ZippyDSM:

---

The 32X and the bad mistakes with the Saturn is what did the most damage to them.

---

Along with the SegaCD add-on & SegaCDX standalone. These REALLY helped it along because of no consumer interest whatsoever. I really wish Sega would have never made certain choices back then because it would have been a much better fight between Ninty, Sega & Sony actually PUSHING technology and home gaming/entertainment instead of unstable, over priced, standard off the shelf components with exorbitant accessories and online MP fees...but I digress.

As for the Saturn - PS3 connection, I can see & understand some of the similarities but the current amount sold (PS3), numerous studios support and track record Sony has in the console region totally negates any small connection those certain aspects compare. Yes anything can happen but it is extremely unlikely. If anything people should be more worrisome about MS & their losses incurred from the original Xbox (4+ Billion) and the current losses (1+ Billion & counting) from RROD (the original 3 lights and current E74, 1 light on the supposed NEW "RROD proof motherboards").

On topic though I don't see the PS2 going away anytime soon for multiple reasons:

1) Continued studio support, remember 140+ Million PS2's have been sold to the public...that is a HUGE consumer base for businesses to tap.

2) New expansion in territories like India & Russia with big incentives for new studios in their respective locales (open source/platform for these areas Source 1, Source 2)

3) Sony still profiting off the PS2 (and PSP) which DEFINITELY helps to off set any losses from the PS3. Although they are close to, or already are, breaking even or very slightly profiting off the PS3 currently; because of manufacturing costs being cut from the jump from 90nm to 65nm and the removal of BC (Source 1, Source 2, Source 3) add that to the 08 fiscal year earnings/sales/profits and there isn't as much doom & gloom as people love to make it out to be.

Search > http://forums.afterdawn.com/search
Rules > http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/2487
Important Rule > http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/380660

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Apr 04, 2009 14:31)

Originally posted by Oner:

---

Originally posted by ZippyDSM:

---

The 32X and the bad mistakes with the Saturn is what did the most damage to them.

---

Along with the SegaCD add-on & SegaCDX standalone. These REALLY helped it along because of no consumer interest whatsoever. I really wish Sega would have never made certain choices back then because it would have been a much better fight between Ninty, Sega & Sony actually PUSHING technology and home gaming/entertainment instead of unstable, over priced, standard off the shelf components with exorbitant accessories and online MP fees...but I digress.

---

I dunno the Sega CD was not sooo bad...but whatever issues it brought the 32X did made things worse.

Well MS was doing something new and needed the money for infrastructure since they were bleeding money building the brand.

I don't think any of them could have implemented a free online system at that time.

Quote:

---

As for the Saturn - PS3 connection, I can see & understand some of the similarities but the current amount sold (PS3), numerous studios support and track record Sony has in the console region totally negates any small connection those certain aspects compare.

---

I disagree the compressions are stark, Issues with design(hardware/code) and price, Issues with dev support and issues with slow sales.

Sony if they were paying attention learned some things from it and managed to try and do more with dev support but they still have a ton of issues and alot of damage from the price and design, but unlike Sega they have enough of a world wide fan base to muddle through until it takes off. Sony has yet to post a profit on the PS3.

Quote:

---

Yes anything can happen but it is extremely unlikely. If anything people should be more worrisome about MS & their losses incurred from the original Xbox (4+ Billion) and the current losses (1+ Billion & counting) from RROD (the original 3 lights and current E74, 1 light on the supposed NEW "RROD proof motherboards").

---

4B on the Xbox that got paid off before the 3B loss on the RROD, MS is a lulz fest indeed.

Quote:

---

On topic though I don't see the PS2 going away anytime soon for multiple reasons:

1) Continued studio support, remember 140+ Million PS2's have been sold to the public...that is a HUGE consumer base for businesses to tap.

2) New expansion in territories like India & Russia with big incentives for new studios in their respective locales (open source/platform for these areas Source 1, Source 2)

3) Sony still profiting off the PS2 (and PSP) which DEFINITELY helps to off set any losses from the PS3. Although they are close to, or already are, breaking even or very slightly profiting off the PS3 currently; because of manufacturing costs being cut from the jump from 90nm to 65nm and the removal of BC (Source 1, Source 2, Source 3) add that to the 08 fiscal year earnings/sales/profits and there isn't as much doom & gloom as people love to make it out to be.

---

Most support for the PS2 will wane off in 3 or less years as most companies can not afford just selling a game to the PS2, PS2 and WII maybe and that just might push more life out of the PS2 but frankly with Sony and their new 2K dev kit that can port most of the code to the 360 I see more effort on PS360 in the coming years unles there is a huge change in the industry..

Comment by: Oner (Apr 04, 2009 15:34)

Originally posted by ZippyDSM:

---

Sony has yet to post a profit on the PS3.

---

While on paper or lack of confirmation you are correct, you have to look at the information provided by them about their cost cutting measures and how it has helped profitability for the Playstation line of products as a whole. It's well known that they are close to or already are breaking even with the PS3 since the sources I provided are quite a few months old already. Not a definitive yes, but Sony is after profitability over market share in these financial times (Source 1, Source 2) and we all know Sony are in it for the long haul with a 10 year plan which is prefaced by the success of the PS2's near decade dominance.

Originally posted by ZippyDSM:

---

4B on the Xbox that got paid off before the 3B loss on the RROD, MS is a lulz fest indeed.

---

From my understanding they have never gotten past the 4 Billion debt incurred by the original Xbox (and where never expected to so it was just absorbed and swept under the carpet). Could you post any links/info that shows different? Also for the 3 Billion in RROD, as all my searching and info has always had it at 1+ Billion and counting.

Originally posted by ZippyDSM:

---

Most support for the PS2 will wane off in 3 or less years as most companies can not afford just selling a game to the PS2, PS2 and WII maybe and that just might push more life out of the PS2 but frankly with Sony and their new 2K dev kit that can port most of the code to the 360 I see more effort on PS360 in the coming years unles there is a huge change in the industry..

---

I absolutely agree with the 3 years or less time frame (which is not anytime soon ;) but that could be different in less developed territories that still want/need an inexpensive option. I also agree about the new dev kits and their pricing helping ease the current state of ports and coding for PS360 multi plat titles. It's a no brainer for a business to cover as much of an audience as possible in these financial times (I won't even get into the cost saving benefits of dev'ing on the PS3 first to port over to the 360 here).

The only huge change in the industry I see happening is MS dropping the 360 in the next 1-2 years coming out with their "NextBox" and shafting their customers again just as they did with the Xbox after only 4 years of support. Planned Obsolescence comes to mind in this situation...

Search > http://forums.afterdawn.com/search
Rules > http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/2487
Important Rule > http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/380660

Comment by: varnull (Apr 04, 2009 15:55)

That's the line with M$ .. "planned obsolescence"

They never release anything cutting edge to market. It's always old code and old tech... Keeps the sheeple buying.

Free open source software = made by end users who want an application to work.
I would rather you hate me for who I am than love me for what I am not.
Welcome to the other side of the looking glass Alice

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Apr 04, 2009 15:56)

Originally posted by Oner:

---

Originally posted by ZippyDSM:

---

Sony has yet to post a profit on the PS3.

While on paper or lack of confirmation you are correct, you have to look at the information provided by them about their cost cutting measures and how it has helped profitability for the Playstation line of products as a whole. It's well known that they are close to or already are breaking even with the PS3 since the sources I provided are quite a few months old already. Not a definitive yes, but Sony is after profitability over market share in these financial times (Source 1, Source 2) and we all know Sony are in it for the long haul with a 10 year plan which is prefaced by the success of the PS2's near decade dominance.

---

I dunno the 360 has dominated well in the US and the EU and from what I have heard they did make a profit off unit sales of the 360 at least before the RROD thing came up.

Sony should do well in the days ahead mostly in another year or 2, the 360 is aged and the WII if limited if it dose not start focusing on real games.

The WII still rules them all they have more profit than the PS360 combined, but that's mostly due to profit off unit sales even if they wane they have made more than most consoles do in a 3-4 year time frame so they are set.

Quote:

---

From my understanding they have never gotten past the 4 Billion debt incurred by the original Xbox (and where never expected to so it was just absorbed and swept under the carpet). Could you post any links/info that shows different? Also for the 3 Billion in RROD, as all my searching and info has always had it at 1+ Billion and counting.

---

I'll have to do some digging in my links I might have it I did some research on the 360 RROD thing but from what I recall they were making a profit before or as the RROD thing was coming to light.

Quote:

---

I absolutely agree with the 3 years or less time frame (which is not anytime soon ;) but that could be different in less developed territories that still want/need an inexpensive option. I also agree about the new dev kits and their pricing helping ease the current state of ports and coding for PS360 multi plat titles. It's a no brainer for a business to cover as much of an audience as possible in these financial times (I won't even get into the cost saving benefits of dev'ing on the PS3 first to port over to the 360 here).

---

Sony is getting it and MS is sticking to their ineptitude but they still has a large fan base witch will serve them well..

Quote:

---

The only huge change in the industry I see happening is MS dropping the 360 in the next 1-2 years coming out with their "NextBox" and shafting their customers again just as they did with the Xbox after only 4 years of support. Planned Obsolescence comes to mind in this situation...

---

I have been told that was a licensing issue with nivida when they jumped to ATI, that and time constraints did not allow them to to make it BWC, its better than oh snap lets rip it out because we fcked up. :P

I believe that the nextbox will have better BWC look at Windose 7 they are learning!! :P

---

Ah modern gaming its like modern film only the watering down of fiction and characters is replaced with shallow and watered down mechanics, gimmicks and shiny-er "people".

Comment by: Oner (Apr 04, 2009 19:57)

Originally posted by varnull:

---

That's the line with M$ .. "planned obsolescence"

They never release anything cutting edge to market. It's always old code and old tech... Keeps the sheeple buying.

---

I couldn't have said it any better myself.

Originally posted by ZippyDSM:

---

I dunno the 360 has dominated well in the US and the EU and from what I have heard they did make a profit off unit sales of the 360 at least before the RROD thing came up.

Sony should do well in the days ahead mostly in another year or 2, the 360 is aged and the WII if limited if it dose not start focusing on real games.

The WII still rules them all they have more profit than the PS360 combined, but that's mostly due to profit off unit sales even if they wane they have made more than most consoles do in a 3-4 year time frame so they are set.

---

US yes, but the EU is definitely not a clear lead for the 360 (despite a 16 month lead Source 1, Source 2, Source 3 and while that info is a bit old the overall sales in the EU for Sony month after month since then has been consistently topping MS) in JP the PS3 is hands down above MS and the same goes for the Aussies so in the world wide stage the standings are clearer when looked at like this

US
1) Wii
2) 360
3) PS3

EU
1) Wii
2) PS3
3) 360

JP
1) Wii
2) PS3
3) 360

AUS
1) Wii
2) PS3
3) 360

#1 - Wii with 4 top spots
#2 - PS3 with 3 2nd place spots & 1 3rd place
#3 - 360 with 3 last place spots & 1 2nd place

Even if you where to say that the EU is a toss up or to play fair a tie (because of a lack of "NPD-Famitsu/Chartget" so we have to go by the 3 console makers numbers themselves for bean counting) that still keeps the standings the same. But you throw in RROD "estimates" worldwide and the PS3's rock solid 0.5-2% sub industry standard failure rate...well, it makes for a great discussion to say the least!

Search > http://forums.afterdawn.com/search
Rules > http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/2487
Important Rule > http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/380660

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Apr 04, 2009 21:08)

Originally posted by Oner:

---

Originally posted by varnull:

---

That's the line with M$ .. "planned obsolescence"

They never release anything cutting edge to market. It's always old code and old tech... Keeps the sheeple buying.

---

I couldn't have said it any better myself.

Originally posted by ZippyDSM:

---

I dunno the 360 has dominated well in the US and the EU and from what I have heard they did make a profit off unit sales of the 360 at least before the RROD thing came up.

Sony should do well in the days ahead mostly in another year or 2, the 360 is aged and the WII if limited if it dose not start focusing on real games.

The WII still rules them all they have more profit than the PS360 combined, but that's mostly due to profit off unit sales even if they wane they have made more than most consoles do in a 3-4 year time frame so they are set.

---

US yes, but the EU is definitely not a clear lead for the 360 (despite a 16 month lead Source 1, Source 2, Source 3 and while that info is a bit old the overall sales in the EU for Sony month after month since then has been consistently topping MS) in JP the PS3 is hands down above MS and the same goes for the Aussies so in the world wide stage the standings are clearer when looked at like this

US
1) Wii
2) 360
3) PS3

EU
1) Wii
2) PS3
3) 360

JP
1) Wii
2) PS3
3) 360

AUS
1) Wii
2) PS3
3) 360

#1 - Wii with 4 top spots
#2 - PS3 with 3 2nd place spots & 1 3rd place
#3 - 360 with 3 last place spots & 1 2nd place

Even if you where to say that the EU is a toss up or to play fair a tie (because of a lack of "NPD-Famitsu/Chartget" so we have to go by the 3 console makers numbers themselves for bean counting) that still keeps the standings the same. But you throw in RROD "estimates" worldwide and the PS3's rock solid 0.5-2% sub industry standard failure rate...well, it makes for a great discussion to say the least!

---

Well I mean by dominate pre ps3, the WII dose not quite effect the 360 market at least not at first.

You can lower the 360 numbers by 30% world wide and distribute the numbers out everywhere evenly and the 360 still has alot of support.

Its pretty clear the 360 is slipping in its place as both the WII and PS3 mature its only a matter of time before the 360 dies in some fashion.

What should really be interesting to see if the 360 starts losing devs/exclusives(particularly Jrpgs) to the PS3 since sony released their new 2K dev kit.

I think Sony leveled the playing field with that manuver now if they drop the price 100$ they will have a flood of people coming to them.

Comment by: Oner (Apr 04, 2009 22:49)

Originally posted by ZippyDSM:

---

What should really be interesting to see if the 360 starts losing devs/exclusives(particularly Jrpgs) to the PS3 since sony released their new 2K dev kit.

I think Sony leveled the playing field with that manuver now if they drop the price 100$ they will have a flood of people coming to them.

---

Losing them is not even that big of a deal...kinda, as they don't have much support anyway! Comparative to Ninty & especially Sony. Just look at how sparse 08's lineup of games where for MS and how 09 is looking even worse.

I believe a price drop is exactly what the PS3 needs to REALLY get things moving but I don't see that happening at least for a few more months while manufacturing cost drop even more and the ramp up for the holiday season 09 + AAA titles get released like Modern Warfare 2, Uncharted 2, GT5, MAG, Heavy Rain, GoW3 to name just a minimal few that are coming for later this year. Though there might just be a drop to $350 way before the holiday season but that is a slim possibility.

The bottom line is that there are too many variables and possibilities for all console manufacturers at any one time! And while certain things I say have an anti MS ere to them; it's just that their business model & practices since day one starting with Windows screw EVERYONE over (especially consumers so I have an inherent disdain for them ;) that I think anyone on aD can agree with lol). But the honest truth is you can't underestimate a company with an ungodly VAST amount of money behind them who are absolutely dead set on controlling our living rooms and the content that is tied to that device that they can profit on by any means necessary...

Search > http://forums.afterdawn.com/search
Rules > http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/2487
Important Rule > http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/380660

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Apr 04, 2009 22:55)

Originally posted by Oner:

---

Originally posted by ZippyDSM:

---

What should really be interesting to see if the 360 starts losing devs/exclusives(particularly Jrpgs) to the PS3 since sony released their new 2K dev kit.

I think Sony leveled the playing field with that manuver now if they drop the price 100$ they will have a flood of people coming to them.

---

Losing them is not even that big of a deal...kinda, as they don't have much support anyway! Comparative to Ninty & especially Sony. Just look at how sparse 08's lineup of games where for MS and how 09 is looking even worse.

I believe a price drop is exactly what the PS3 needs to REALLY get things moving but I don't see that happening at least for a few more months while manufacturing cost drop even more and the ramp up for the holiday season 09 + AAA titles get released like Modern Warfare 2, Uncharted 2, GT5, MAG, Heavy Rain, GoW3 to name just a minimal few that are coming for later this year.

The bottom line is that there are too many variables and possibilities for all console manufacturers at any one time! And while certain things I say have an anti MS ere to them; it's just that their business model & practices since day one starting with Windows screw EVERYONE over (especially consumers so I have an inherent disdain for them ;) that I think anyone on aD can agree with lol). But the honest truth is you can't underestimate a company with an ungodly VAST amount of money behind them who are absolutely dead set on controlling our living rooms and the content that is tied to that device that they can profit on by any means necessary...

---

Don't they(and games lie them that are starting to come out on the the 360 first or only) fire up the Asian market?

MS dose well in the US with its mindless twitch fests dose so so in the UK but those JP and Asian deved games( secondary or no) tend to do better in the somewhat vital Asian markets, the 360 has been making some ground in that respect but sony has set them up the bomb once it goes off the 360 will be buried under a mountain.

Every little bit of momentum lost for the 360 is one more nail in its coffin.

Comment by: DXR88 (Apr 05, 2009 01:08)

the 360 isn't going anywhere, its backed by a multi billion dollar giant. MS and Sony will be At it till one falls or gives up, and Sony is looking really grim.

I don't even use my 360 that much anymore since i upgraded my computer.

i do use it however for those really bad ports. im looking forward for the new Star Ocean on 360

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Apr 05, 2009 12:35)

Originally posted by DXR88:

---

the 360 isn't going anywhere, its backed by a multi billion dollar giant. MS and Sony will be At it till one falls or gives up, and Sony is looking really grim.

I don't even use my 360 that much anymore since i upgraded my computer.

i do use it however for those really bad ports. im looking forward for the new Star Ocean on 360

---

Its not a port though :P

Comment by: rasell (Apr 06, 2009 13:41)

Hi,
Well general discussion is good thing we should improve our basic needs through this type of websites.

Comment by: DVDBack23 (Apr 07, 2009 05:40)

Quote:

---

it's just that their business model & practices since day one starting with Windows screw EVERYONE over (especially consumers so I have an inherent disdain for them ;) that I think anyone on aD can agree with lol). But the honest truth is you can't underestimate a company with an ungodly VAST amount of money behind them who are absolutely dead set on controlling our living rooms and the content that is tied to that device that they can profit on by any means necessary...

---

I believe you typoed there, that is Apple...the most anti-consumer company on the planet.

Comment by: Oner (Apr 07, 2009 12:19)

Originally posted by DVDBack23:

---

Quote:

---

it's just that their business model & practices since day one starting with Windows screw EVERYONE over (especially consumers so I have an inherent disdain for them ;) that I think anyone on aD can agree with lol). But the honest truth is you can't underestimate a company with an ungodly VAST amount of money behind them who are absolutely dead set on controlling our living rooms and the content that is tied to that device that they can profit on by any means necessary...

---

I believe you typoed there, that is Apple...the most anti-consumer company on the planet.

---

You're right in that, but Apple (and even Sony to an extent) has been more of an issue in recent years. More so than MS (since the early 80's) with their business model of stealing/copying/ripping people off and screwing consumers with blatantly crappy products without any accountability.

Search > http://forums.afterdawn.com/search
Rules > http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/2487
Important Rule > http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/380660