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Comment by: TBandit (Nov 08, 2008 07:05)

I think because 360 also has alot of platinum games out, the cheap 20$ ones.

Comment by: susieqbbb (Nov 08, 2008 15:44)

Higher attach rate yes!!!

I will buy this!!!

But!!!

Not high enough for family's to purchase the console for there kids due to the highly violent games on the 360.

The wii and ps3 all though they are doing ok they have titles for all ages the only titles recently i have seen for kids this year on the 360 is banjo kazooie kinda lame.

And with the recent set of drive hacks and mod's xbox live is becoming a place where cheaters thrive and real gamers die.

So better not really strong system sales sometimes and even with cheaper titles the console still needs that extra boost this holiday season with the poor economy you now have to ask do i eat or purchase a 200.00 video game.

Comment by: windsong (Nov 08, 2008 19:21)

I'll stick with PC games. Ba$tards STILL have not fixed the RROD. Might as well enjoy burning your money in the fireplace than to give it to the SUITS at Microsoft.

Comment by: Dela (Nov 08, 2008 20:00)

I have had the same XBox 360 since 2005, played at least 40 games on it for many hundreds and hundreds of hours since, and even hundreds more for XviD, AVC etc. I have never experienced anything resembling RROD. In addition, my brother has an Xbox 360 for a year or so and he uses it even more than I do (mostly on Live) and I have a lot of friends who bought 360 because it came down in price, I've yet to hear one complain about RROD. Everytime there is an Xbox 360 article thats all I see is "RROD RROD RROD RROD", I understand people literally hate Microsoft, and I am more than aware there are ppl who experienced RROD many times (one of our Admins actually is on his 3rd 360 since 2005) but the idea that every Xbox 360 owner is plagued by hardware bugs is simply false, if it was true, it would be much much bigger news.

In saying that I also totally agree that M$ made a very stupid decision pushing out Xbox 360 so early with such bad defects.

Comment by: Dela (Nov 08, 2008 20:14)

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Not high enough for family's to purchase the console for there kids due to the highly violent games on the 360.

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Well putting aside the fact that its a parent's job to control the content their kids are exposed to and not M$, there is a reason the console has parent control features built in.

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The wii and ps3 all though they are doing ok they have titles for all ages the only titles recently i have seen for kids this year on the 360 is banjo kazooie kinda lame.

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With Wii you might have a point, since it's geared more as a family console (but has plenty of violent games of its own now). When I go to gamestop though, I see plenty of games suitable for kids sold on Xbox 360 and PS3.

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And with the recent set of drive hacks and mod's xbox live is becoming a place where cheaters thrive and real gamers die.

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Not true, drive hacks will only boot backups of games and playing backups on Live will get you banned. Drive hacks don't allow for homebrew or anything else that would make it easier to cheat.

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So better not really strong system sales sometimes and even with cheaper titles the console still needs that extra boost this holiday season with the poor economy you now have to ask do i eat or purchase a 200.00 video game.

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Strangely enough gaming sales don't seem to be affected by economic downturns as would be expected. I guess it's because it's a better decision to get a game that will provide a lot more entertainment than going to see a movie or buying music CDs or DVDs. New games are quite expensive, but older titles (even just 1-2 years out) drop in price pretty quickly so I'd assume they'll sell well.

Comment by: creaky (Nov 08, 2008 20:19)

Hey there Dela, long time no see.
I am contemplating a 360 (i usually wait 'til consoles have been superceded but in the case of 360's i've wanted one for a while) but must admit i've been put off by the endless horror stories of RROD.
What i aim to do is buy one, but from somewhere that i'll be sure that i can send it back if i get stung by the RROD..

Now if only someone would come up with an XBMC equivalent, i'd buy loads of the machines :p

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Comment by: locobrown (Nov 08, 2008 22:28)

Most of us already own or would like a 360 but its already been 3 years since its launch date. For example, The Xbox 1 was launched on November 15, 2001 and 4 years later NVIDIA ceased production of the Xbox's GPU in August 2005. I bought my xbox in 2004 and 1 year it became obsolete. At this point in time, many of us can sense that maybe in a year or two the 360 may be replaced by another version. The RROD is the reason why microsoft hasn't been able to dominate the market. Why even consider purchasing a new console? I happened to once and I don't want it to happen to me again. I bought my 360 during its launch and have had various service repairs, if it continues to fail I'll keep on shipping it back for repair, but I wouldn't buy a new one.

Comment by: Jemborg (Nov 08, 2008 23:06)

Gidday Creaky, dunno if this helps "Quick Media Converter"

http://www.softpedia.com/get/Multimedia/...Converter.shtml

If you did get a X360 this excellent (and fast) freeware app will help, does HD too- you know the X360 has a (albeit limited) MC in it already (it will function with an external drive too, may have to be formatted in Fat32).

There are plenty of good reasons to get a 360, and I would be accused perhaps of going off-topic if I listed them here. (And get flamed to buggery). It's not as underpowered as some would like to believe. And I really have to second Dela in the RROD ad nauseam comment.

Of course fanboys are gonna constantly go on about it, discounting it's games catalogue and their own "BluRay-of-death" issues (I'm in for it now lol). But the more recent units are much better- my own Falcon Arcade model (check the date) has an extra piped heatsink running from the GPU for instance.

I would suggest getting long-life NiCads and a fast recharger instead of the pack, it's cheaper and more versatile.

Unfortunately, even if you bought the unit locally, after the first month or so the policy is that the unit has to be posted (by you, they pay tho) to some place in the country for repairs. I think that's the same for the PS3.

Edit: Locobrown, are you suggesting that the Xbox1 ceased production because nVidia decided to stop making the GPU?

Maybe you're right but I personally don't think that M$ will stop production of the X360 in 1 or 2 years. I reckon that's conjecture based on the Xbox1. It's easy to consider the PS2 obsolete, but isn't it still outselling the PS3? Obsolescence never stopped poeple from enjoying their retro fun. Besides I think M$ has invested too much in the X360 to dump it for a new platform just yet.

Comment by: locobrown (Nov 09, 2008 02:38)

That's true. A large amount of money has been invested, but they have also recorded huge amount of losses. I would really like to buy a new console but microsoft wasn't addressed a longevity prediction for the 360 that I'm aware of. The 360 was rushed because after NVIDIA stopped making the GPU then almost immediately in November of that same year the 360 was released.

Comment by: Dela (Nov 09, 2008 08:27)

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Hey there Dela, long time no see.
I am contemplating a 360 (i usually wait 'til consoles have been superceded but in the case of 360's i've wanted one for a while) but must admit i've been put off by the endless horror stories of RROD.
What i aim to do is buy one, but from somewhere that i'll be sure that i can send it back if i get stung by the RROD..

Now if only someone would come up with an XBMC equivalent, i'd buy loads of the machines :p

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Ye XBMC on Xbox 360 would be very neat indeed. It's a fairly decent little media player though when you set up your network for it. As for RROD, ye in the beginning there were a lot more issues than now, but the point I was trying to make earlier is it's not as "doom and gloom" as some people would want you to believe. I only know of 1 guy, an aD admin, who is on his third Xbox 360, and each time the problem was covered by warranty and it was replaced. As I also said, I bought mine in December 2005, and its still going strong.

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The RROD is the reason why microsoft hasn't been able to dominate the market. Why even consider purchasing a new console?

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I don't think RROD is really affecting it _that_ much at all to be honest. You have to take in the facts. The console launched early in 2005, over a year ahead of the PS3 (15 months if in Europe), and so in 2006 there was one very noticeable thing; a fairly crappy supply of games, until late into the year when it was time to start fighting with Sony. There is no doubt that 2007 was a better year for games line-up for the Xbox 360 and a terrible year for Sony, and besides the price tag, the sales of the hardware definitely showed it.

Sony got its act together more toward the end of last year (no point in having a swiss army knife if you've nothing to use it with) and its decisions reflected in its sales. Now if you follow them, they are basically pulling and dragging out of each other because they both have decent game line-ups (and right now is a good time for games), but one thing neither of them expected in 2005... was Wii! The difference in hardware and everything else doesn't matter when it comes to the bottom line, consumers don't have infinite expendable income so regardless of what you might be told, Wii "does" definitely hurt both Xbox 360 and PS3.

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That's true. A large amount of money has been invested, but they have also recorded huge amount of losses. I would really like to buy a new console but microsoft wasn't addressed a longevity prediction for the 360 that I'm aware of. The 360 was rushed because after NVIDIA stopped making the GPU then almost immediately in November of that same year the 360 was released.

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It's only out three years, it has years left. Heck, they are launching the new dashboard and a shit load of new stuff for the console this month, they have absolutely no plans to cease production of the console. As for the losses... it's Microsoft, they can take it because they are in it for the long haul, its a multi-billion industry and there's a lot of license fees etc. that Sony, Nintendo and M$ stand to gain from the software sales. This is not Xbox 1, Microsoft is pushing to win this generation. Whatever way it will go, we have to wait and see, but there's absolutely no way the console has a 4 year life-span on the market, it would be an insane move.

Comment by: Jemborg (Nov 09, 2008 08:52)

Originally posted by locobrown:

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That's true. A large amount of money has been invested, but they have also recorded huge amount of losses. I would really like to buy a new console but microsoft wasn't addressed a longevity prediction for the 360 that I'm aware of. The 360 was rushed because after NVIDIA stopped making the GPU then almost immediately in November of that same year the 360 was released.

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Hmmm, I would have thought nVidia would cheerfully have kept making the GPU chip if a huge customer like M$ kept wanting it- it makes commercial sense. Also consider the time it takes to design a new console and factor in that they had a special version of the IBM Xeon series developed for the CPU (NOT a typical PC chip), a new deal with ATI and another specialist GPU... I'd say the rushing was to get the drop on $ony in install base terms.

I have no idea as to their mentality in dropping the Xbox1 utterly like they did. Akin to the XP vs. Fista OSs. It's reasonable they would want to see a return on the 360 after the losses. Hence no new console for a while yet. Bourne out by the new versions they've been bringing out- see my post above (I'm not sure what you mean by "...wasn't addressed a longevity prediction...") I think it's clear they have been addressing the issue.

None of the consoles are well made imo in longevity terms. Plenty of the sales of PS2s would be for replacements- they're cheap now and folks want to keep their game collection alive. After all, I'm on my second PS2 myself- it's life extended by the use of a 120GB HDD this time.

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Nov 10, 2008 00:17)

Add up the attach rate times the total unit sales the WII is the clear winner on software sold.

MS is going to have to push 10-20M more units or double their attach rate to outpace the WII.

Comment by: Jemborg (Nov 10, 2008 01:04)

ROFLMAO

I thought this article was going to put someone's nose out of joint- haha LOL.

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Nov 10, 2008 01:22)

Originally posted by Jemborg:

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ROFLMAO

I thought this article was going to put someone's nose out of joint- haha LOL.

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Fact dose that alot.....
WII 5X 35= 175M
360 6X 22= 132
PS3 5X 16=80

The WII is the clear winner add up the profit and again its the clear winner these are facts not accusations, now an accusation would be you HAVE to reduce the 360s number by 30% because the fail rate has effect sales across the board, even so the real effect is more likely 15% so even with a loss of nearly 20M you're still doing much better than the PS3 :P.

Attach rate is blunderbuss catch phrase to make sht look better than it is, I can say I have a a 100X attach rate and mislead others by ignoring I have sold only 10K player units.

BTW how are the newest 360s doing? Iam still putting off fckign with it.... er I mean buying a new unit after selling of my Xcrap a year ago...

Comment by: Jemborg (Nov 10, 2008 01:31)

heh *wipes tear from eye*

It's going just fine thanks for asking Zip- plays my backups really great, can't wait for the new dashboard.

Even painted the sucker gloss black and stuck an all-chrome faceplate on it- looks really smick. :P

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Nov 10, 2008 01:41)

Originally posted by Jemborg:

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heh *wipes tear from eye*

It's going just fine thanks for asking Zip- plays my backups really great, can't wait for the new dashboard.

Even painted the sucker gloss black and stuck an all-chrome faceplate on it- looks really smick. :P

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So basically it looks like a larger PS3 but plays 360 games*hides*.


You have it chiped or softmoded? ^^

edit
Just think if console makers did not try so hard to copy protect the unit you would increase unit sales by 50% even if software sales slug back 20% the ratios would balance out and a serge in unit sales can only mean more software is bought somewhere down the line. MS by ignorance or intelligence has done this well...I just am not found of limited console controls(button mapping) now adays I have gravtiated more to the PC.

Comment by: Jemborg (Nov 10, 2008 02:14)

WHAT???

Haha yeah. Did do one up for someone that was purple with silver flecks- but what do you expect from a gurl?

Softmod. The Via Sata card is really cheap now too. Softly softly catchy monkey. :D

It's not the first time I've heard that sentiment in your edit expressed Zip.

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Nov 10, 2008 02:25)

Originally posted by Jemborg:

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WHAT???

Haha yeah. Did do one up for someone that was purple with silver flecks- but what do you expect from a gurl?

Softmod. The Via Sata card is really cheap now too. Softly softly catchy monkey. :D

It's not the first time I've heard that sentiment in your edit expressed Zip.

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The control accept or the less "protection" aspect? :P

The 360 is a sound system even more so with it stealing more PCesqce titles but the rush in development that the industry has gotten into has just left me cold its like the republicans becoming solisctis for big biz I haz been left behind, I could chock down more console titles at the current imbalance of price V quality if they just mandated full button mapping across the board I could get back into gaming...

Comment by: L-Burna (Nov 10, 2008 03:09)

Its possible to run XBMC off a dev unit,but it won't happen on most regular units without being able to gain access into the nand firmware.I've seen a couple systems with earlier kernels and firmware use XBMC,but they are launch consoles with extremely old kernels.Besides you would have to install the infectus modchip with the timing attack add-on,and have your drive flashed in order to run linux.I've been waiting for some type of method that could gain access into the nand firmware for any kernel version now that would be nice,because XBMC and whatever you want could happen.The sad thing is I already checked up on it,and would like to see something similar as well.For those that are interested in XBMC for the XBox 360 you must look into the nand firmware hacks.Anything is possible once you gain access to the nand firmware as it contains pretty much everything you want to know.

...........................:SiG cReAtEd By Phantom69:............................

Comment by: Jemborg (Nov 10, 2008 04:11)

*I know we are all swerving a little off-topic moderators, but things are slow here and so I'm just chatting with a mate :D*


I was referring to the protection comment Zip.

I personally am not so worried the button mapping myself. I kinda think that's up to the game developer myself- after all it's their creation and they may have some particular thing in mind when they map the controls they way they do. However, I do sympathise with your point of view and I have wished on a few occasions with certain types of games they'd made it more flexible. (I thought that screen positioning should have been mandatory for the PS2's system.)

I think there are good reasons for why some people may want to choose the ease of a console over a PC. They're cheaper and less hassle for most. But at the same time PC gaming is awesome too, so don't get me wrong, different strokes etc. I do do games like WoW (*loser*) and there is no way you could console that. But at times I really like relaxing back into the sofa surrounded by cushions and using a controller.

Heh, you know the X360 controllers are pretty good and ironically work with a wireless adapter in most any PC game that will accept joypads, the FF wheel or the headset. When nVidia get around to a cheap dualcore GPU on a super-quiet HDMI card I'll get one- hang the expense. Got a fanless 8600gt atm- it is for the lounge. One rocket engine in the roam is enough heh.

L-Burna... what ever happened to the King Kong shader exploit? They got Linux up and running with that. Without a chip I believe.

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Nov 10, 2008 04:24)

Jemborg

You miss the point on button mapping on today's rushed and well...questionably developed games frustration factor from bad design makes than games not worth the price, button mapping makes the game easier to play because it lets indevendauls enjoy a game as much as they can sooner.


Its just a no brainier, devs are to busy building the game control is oft the last thing they do and the cookie cutter layouts suck.

For instance it took me a month after I beat Halo 2 to somewhat enjoy playing it, by putting in button mapping and making it a standard you expand the market you sale to as you gain more consumers from disabled,old and other groups as well as let gamers enjoy intrefeaceing with the product that much more..

Comment by: Jemborg (Nov 10, 2008 08:59)

Speak up Sonny Jim... you played what??

Hallo 2 U 2.

Comment by: L-Burna (Nov 13, 2008 23:25)

Hey Jemborg I know I'm late on the reply,but the reason the exploit doesn't work anymore is because Microsoft patched all the kernels and did some hardware revisions.In this case the eFuses if you blow them on later revisions then your pretty much screwed,but I wouldn't say it can't be done just gotta look for alternative methods.The nand firmware can still be dumped on any system its the scheme they use in order to decrypt it which is the problem.If Linux can be installed a different way besides using the hacked firmware,and a fix for the blown eFuses arises a softmod might develop from it.That is a long shot though,because its pretty complicated as its dealing with hardware and encryption schemes.For all I know Microsoft could have implemented some off the wall encryption scheme over the years,but finding a solution for the hardware revisions is a problem.

...........................:SiG cReAtEd By Phantom69:............................

Comment by: Jemborg (Nov 14, 2008 09:04)

Hey L-Burna. Yeah i kinda figured something like that from your previous posts here. I'm a little astounded that M$ would go to the extent of sabotaging your equipment, at least that's how it effectively turns out.

Lot of paranoid effort on their part just to stop you from running someone else's OS on the bloody thing. Suppose when you can put together or buy a cheap second hand pc, it's hardly worth it to run linux on it, perhaps from the sheer bold-assed challenge of it.

I suppose they can wank on about piracy and all, but if $ony let you run Linux on a PS3, it just comes across as utter bloody-mindedness on their part.