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Comment by: susieqbbb (Aug 20, 2008 05:19)

Not surprising considering sony is in the hole 84 billion dollers on blu-ray and the production of playstation 3's alone.

And yet they still haven't fixed the main reason why there consoles are not selling.

1. To expensive

2. not any really fun games and a lot of games are recycled

3. a controller with no replaceable battery's

4. a blu-ray drive that is failing and that consumers cannot afford.

Comment by: 13thHouR (Aug 20, 2008 09:28)

Sony Has Lost More on the PS3 Than it Made on PS2

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Speaking at the Games Convention Developers Conference this afternoon, industry veteran Dave Perry (most known for his studio Shiny Entertainment and its games Enter the Matrix and Earthworm Jim), gave an overview of the games industry as he sees it today. When discussing the current console race, he brought up some interesting statistics that he obtained from research firm DFC Intelligence. According to Perry, Sony has lost more money selling PlayStation 3s than it made selling PlayStation 2s during the entire five years of its peak. So basically, all of the money Sony made on hardware last generation -- it's already spent more to sell the PS3 at a loss so far. Some estimates put that loss at $3 billion.

Of course, videogame manufacturers typically follow the Gillette razor blade model and sell their hardware at a loss (at least for the first few years) only to recoup the costs on software. (Nintendo's Wii is an exception -- it's estimated that even out of the gate Nintendo has already been making $40 per console). But Sony's PS2, the best selling videogame console of all time, was making a healthy profit on each unit sold as of a few years ago. Seemingly all of that went to fund the PS3 hardware that Sony has been selling -- and for the foreseeable future will continue to sell -- at a loss. (Some estimates at one point put it at $260 per console, though manufacturing costs have steadily come down in the past year).

Perry didn't use this point to take any particular stance on this console race -- though he did state that DFC Intelligence puts the Wii as the victor this generation, with the PS3 coming in first in terms of overall software sales -- but he did want to point out the extreme investment Sony is making in its hardware this generation. He (and DFC) predict Sony will extend this generation even longer than the PS2's because of this (making Sony's claims of 10-year life cycle a real possibility). Of course, the Xbox 360, especially considering its $1 billion in replacement costs for faulty hardware, has likely cost Microsoft just as much, if not more. But Microsoft's entire foray into the videogame business has been a costly multi-billion dollar investment (Microsoft lost $4 billion on its original Xbox alone), whereas Sony's games division has only recently been forced to spend so heavily to hold on to its status in the games market (and to force the adoption of an HD media standard).

Putting things in perspective, though, Sony did lose quite a bit on PS2 hardware in its first year or so -- likely not $3 billion, but still. If things continue to move in Sony's favor and the PS3 manages to have a healthy 10-year life cycle (it's possible...the 8-year old PS2 managed to outsell both the Xbox 360 and the PS3 last year), it's still possible, when all is said and done, that the company can break even on hardware costs this generation. Or maybe eventually even make a profit. At this rate it'd better; who knows what the PlayStation 4 could end up costing the company.

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Comment by: canuckerz (Aug 20, 2008 12:53)

Originally posted by susieqbbb:

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Not surprising considering sony is in the hole 84 billion dollers on blu-ray and the production of playstation 3's alone.

And yet they still haven't fixed the main reason why there consoles are not selling.

1. To expensive

2. not any really fun games and a lot of games are recycled

3. a controller with no replaceable battery's

4. a blu-ray drive that is failing and that consumers cannot afford.

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1.) I bought mine after working my first part time job and it was worth every penny, saying it is expensive is just an excuse for people being cheap and only wanting bare bones. And if a 12-13 year old cant afford it then good, there is nothing people hate more than little kids on online games when they don't even meet the age req.

2.)That may have been true last Christmas but come this Christmas that is going to be a thing of the past.

3.) If I had to put AA batteries in my controller every time it ran out I would be majorly pissed, In fact I'd rather a wired controller. I love my lithium ion battery and they CAN be replaced you just have to take the controller apart which is a pain but the whole controller would need to be replaced sooner than that battery.

4.) This problem has been fixed on the newer consoles and through firmware updates and I'd gladly pay the extra money for bluray if it means i get a better quality game as a result. Its not like the games themselves cost more as a result; to the consumer I mean.

Comment by: Vr0cK (Aug 20, 2008 13:15)

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1.) I bought mine after working my first part time job and it was worth every penny, saying it is expensive is just an excuse for people being cheap and only wanting bare bones. And if a 12-13 year old cant afford it then good, there is nothing people hate more than little kids on online games when they don't even meet the age req.

2.)That may have been true last Christmas but come this Christmas that is going to be a thing of the past.

3.) If I had to put AA batteries in my controller every time it ran out I would be majorly pissed, In fact I'd rather a wired controller. I love my lithium ion battery and they CAN be replaced you just have to take the controller apart which is a pain but the whole controller would need to be replaced sooner than that battery.

4.) This problem has been fixed on the newer consoles and through firmware updates and I'd gladly pay the extra money for bluray if it means i get a better quality game as a result. Its not like the games themselves cost more as a result; to the consumer I mean.

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Agreed.

Comment by: Hunt720 (Aug 20, 2008 14:49)

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1.) I bought mine after working my first part time job and it was worth every penny, saying it is expensive is just an excuse for people being cheap and only wanting bare bones. And if a 12-13 year old cant afford it then good, there is nothing people hate more than little kids on online games when they don't even meet the age req.
*and why drop the price on a console that Sony is has already A: dropped the price on... and B: Undersells as it is based on the machines specs alone.
2.)That may have been true last Christmas but come this Christmas that is going to be a thing of the past. *agreed. Not to mention it has been a thing of the past for a while. People who don't own one still claim this in trolling attempts in an effort to ignore stellar titles they have never played. i.e. Warhawk, MGS4, MGO, Uncharted, Resistance, and the myriad of exclusive PSN titles just to name a few. Not to mention that the majority of PS exclusives are undoable on the 360 even with multiple discs.

3.) If I had to put AA batteries in my controller every time it ran out I would be majorly pissed, In fact I'd rather a wired controller. I love my lithium ion battery and they CAN be replaced you just have to take the controller apart which is a pain but the whole controller would need to be replaced sooner than that battery. again.. the "replaceable/rechargeable" bricks on the bottom of the 360 controller are not a selling point. They do nothing but force consumers to buy a more expensive controller with rechargeable batteries.. or to constantly pay for batteries. Most people own 2 controllers.. I leave one charging on the usb, and if my Dualshock runs out I just swap controllers and charge the one I was using... and I dont have to take the controller apart to do so.

4.) This problem has been fixed on the newer consoles and through firmware updates and I'd gladly pay the extra money for bluray if it means i get a better quality game as a result. Its not like the games themselves cost more as a result; to the consumer I mean.

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EXACTLY. Blu-Ray titles cost EXACTLY the same as a DVD9-360 title and hold MUCH MUCH more data on one disc. This means higher resolution textures, higher quality audio, and simply more game data without the need for extra discs or increasingly complex compression schemes. The % of failed blu-ray drives is under 3%.. we don't even need to do a failure rate comparison here.


I have owned both. Like what you want. Play what you want. But don't bash a conslole you have never owned out of sheer bias and expect people to respect your opinion. And if you do feel the need to do this in the future.. cite some actual reasons like 13thhour did... despite the fact his reason supports why there will not need to be a price drop. Its not like Sony sold Millions of consoles that overheated, so why would they.
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Comment by: emugamer (Aug 20, 2008 16:44)

What is meant by "there are no fun games for the PS3?" Aside from the few exclusives, the 360 and PS3 have practically the same game catalog. Most games are multi-console. The Wii is a different beast altogether. Everyone defines fun differently, and 95% of the people I know, or talked to over the age of 20 would pick a PS3 or 360 over a Wii. I'm 30 and the Wii to me is a novelty - a gimmick. I don't want to swing my arms in the air to play a game.

@13thHouR - That's a good article. Puts things in perspective without bias towards one or the other.

I predict the PS3 lasting long enough to re-coup losses. Unfortunately, I also predict the 360 having a shorter life-cycle and fading in the PS3's dust in a couple of years. But they will probably have a new console out and abandon the 360, just like they did with the XBOX. I have to say that it's nice that Sony is still churning out titles for the PS2 and is expected to continue into 2009. And I'm having a hard time finding a reliable source of 3rd party hardware replacements for my XBOX.

Comment by: bdoggie08 (Aug 20, 2008 17:46)

Originally posted by susieqbbb:

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Not surprising considering sony is in the hole 84 billion dollers on blu-ray and the production of playstation 3's alone.

And yet they still haven't fixed the main reason why there consoles are not selling.

1. To expensive

2. not any really fun games and a lot of games are recycled

3. a controller with no replaceable battery's

4. a blu-ray drive that is failing and that consumers cannot afford.

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Xbox fanboyish biased opinions ranked in order. Good work.

Comment by: DXR88 (Aug 20, 2008 19:21)

Tsk...Tsk...

I came to read an article and some productive input and all i got was a bunch of bickering from it, go figure don't even know why we talk about consoles anymore.

Back to topic:

it doesn't need a a price drop it needs more exclusives to make it more attractive to the consumer. the first PS3 i owned suffered from drive failure after about 3 weeks of play, also it destroyed the game it wasn't exactly a fun experience in the least. i got it back and it works fine now.

Comment by: emugamer (Aug 20, 2008 19:48)

Definitely needs more exclusives, but also more innovative ideas. The last one with the PSN video rental service was a huge let-down for me. The latest E3 updates on Home seem promising. It's just frustrating how long it's taking. As long as standalone bluray players are out of most peoples price range, the cost of the PS3 will probably stay where it is.

Comment by: spamual (Aug 21, 2008 02:16)

im a sony fanboy, but just because the blu rays can hold higher res textures in it doesnt mean it can use it. you will not find games withtheir native res at 1920x1080 on a PS3, as it has a card comparible to tha 7800GTX, which is 4 generations old, and wont be able to run squat at 1920x1080

Comment by: varnull (Aug 21, 2008 02:47)

So far from what I see of the ps3 iso dumps they could easily put the games on a dvd-9.. the rest is all junk data and copy proofing.

I was hoping for a sensible discussion about rip off game pricing too, but no.. just the usual fanyboy "sony is well up my a££ and I love it" trolls. Better games and more gameplay and they might.. I SAID MIGHT see some of these overpriced consoles start to move.. so far all they have is exactly the same as is being offered by the 360 at considerably less cost.. a few unique games and not a lot else.

BTW.. calling people who don't think £400 on a toy is good value cheap just shows what an overconsuming spoiled brat you really are.. I have 6" stillettos and a whip.. want to be my doormat for a while instead of $onys? I will throw you away when I'm done with you too ;)

Free open source software = made by end users who want an application to work. An engineer with a single tool in his toolbox is an idiot, not an engineer

Comment by: DXR88 (Aug 21, 2008 03:41)

the most iv seen used so far that wasn't junk on the disc was 14GB.

Yes innovation could be had now, with the increased storage in Disc size but they wont take the opportunity to get out of the bland. while i agree Sony has handed Developers a very powerful system, the developers wont take advantage of it, if they did it would make games exclusive to the PS3 and most money hunger development teams which sad to say is like 80 percent of the market only care about multi-platform.

if you where a developer what would you do with that 30+ gigs you've been given.

the console itself is a powerhouse, and is worth all $400.00 a Blade system with the same processor is price between $1200-$2200.

its a technical marvel no doubt, but its marvel is muddied in no real use of that power.

Comment by: Hunt720 (Aug 21, 2008 17:34)

Originally posted by varnull:

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So far from what I see of the ps3 iso dumps they could easily put the games on a dvd-9.. the rest is all junk data and copy proofing.

I was hoping for a sensible discussion about rip off game pricing too, but no.. just the usual fanyboy "sony is well up my a££ and I love it" trolls. Better games and more gameplay and they might.. I SAID MIGHT see some of these overpriced consoles start to move.. so far all they have is exactly the same as is being offered by the 360 at considerably less cost.. a few unique games and not a lot else.

BTW.. calling people who don't think £400 on a toy is good value cheap just shows what an overconsuming spoiled brat you really are.. I have 6" stillettos and a whip.. want to be my doormat for a while instead of $onys? I will throw you away when I'm done with you too ;)

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And in an ironic twist you continue to add to the trolling you hate sooo much. Way to snuff your arguement with hypocracy.

Comment by: fergus100 (Aug 21, 2008 20:42)

price cut will come at tgs i know it

Comment by: Chelidze (Aug 22, 2008 09:32)

With price cut ore with out it is still the best buy you complain that
400 $ costs to much. In my country it costs 800$ but people do not complain about it

Comment by: 13thHouR (Aug 22, 2008 09:56)

Originally posted by Hunt720:

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Originally posted by varnull:

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So far from what I see of the ps3 iso dumps they could easily put the games on a dvd-9.. the rest is all junk data and copy proofing.

I was hoping for a sensible discussion about rip off game pricing too, but no.. just the usual fanyboy "sony is well up my a££ and I love it" trolls. Better games and more gameplay and they might.. I SAID MIGHT see some of these overpriced consoles start to move.. so far all they have is exactly the same as is being offered by the 360 at considerably less cost.. a few unique games and not a lot else.

BTW.. calling people who don't think £400 on a toy is good value cheap just shows what an overconsuming spoiled brat you really are.. I have 6" stillettos and a whip.. want to be my doormat for a while instead of $onys? I will throw you away when I'm done with you too ;)

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And in an ironic twist you continue to add to the trolling you hate sooo much. Way to snuff your arguement with hypocracy.

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the funny thing is hunt720 is that arguments are not actually trolling, i think you have failed to actually read varnull's post and just gone, its anti ps3 SHOUT SHOUT SHOUT OMG FANBOY ATTACKING MY BELOVED BRAND.

try to get a grip little girl.