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Comment by: nonoitall (Jul 08, 2011 01:26)

I guess I just see it as an opportunity for developers to have more flexibility in customizing their own services. It seems like some sort of OpenID-esque system could easily solve the issue of multiple credentials too. But most everything we can say about this is supposition at this point, since we still don't know how much/little the services will have in common.

Comment by: bobiroc (Jul 08, 2011 03:36)

Originally posted by brockie:

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this console keeps getting worse every time I hear about it. terrible idea not to have one set of online rules they can now support or nonsupport it as they see fit devs. different sign-ins for every game Nintendo say they want hardcore gamers they have no clue.

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Ever hear of ID linking?? Kind of like logging into 3rd party websites using your Facebook Credentials?

I think this presents opportunity for choice and flexibility.

Comment by: KillerBug (Jul 08, 2011 05:09)

This is a bad idea in business terms, but it sounds like it will be good for users. By fragmenting the trophy systems, they will destroy most of the "trophy whore" mentality.

Just look at the PC...you don't see people buying $20 games that they hate just for the trophies and you don't see people buying foreign versions of the games they already own just to get double trophies.

Also, when people hack the system (and they will...to enable BluRay playback), some online gaming will remain as there won't be a single unified front against playing from hacked consoles.

Comment by: Interestx (Jul 08, 2011 06:10)

Quote:

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KillerBug
Also, when people hack the system (and they will...to enable BluRay playback

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And what if it turns out that in order to side-step patents and royalties Nintendo have installed a laser that cannot focus on more than a single layer?
No software hack in the world is going to make limited hardware go beyond its abilities.
You might possibly hack for the BD25 Blu-rays but would anyone even bother if it turns out that none of the 50gb DL Blu-ray discs would work?

I'd not leap to any conclusions about what the Wii U can or can't do until it's stripped down & the components seen.

Comment by: brockie (Jul 08, 2011 13:11)

@KillerBug I have got so much more out of games since they added Achievements & Trophies not that I would buy a game just for Trophies.

Comment by: brockie (Jul 08, 2011 13:14)

@bobiroc & that is better why the reason Live & PSN are so good is because they control it. the console is not a major improvement on what we have now imo Nintendo are cheap.

Comment by: Mr-Movies (Jul 08, 2011 20:14)

Originally posted by Interestx:

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Quote:

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KillerBug
Also, when people hack the system (and they will...to enable BluRay playback

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And what if it turns out that in order to side-step patents and royalties Nintendo have installed a laser that cannot focus on more than a single layer?
No software hack in the world is going to make limited hardware go beyond its abilities.
You might possibly hack for the BD25 Blu-rays but would anyone even bother if it turns out that none of the 50gb DL Blu-ray discs would work?

I'd not leap to any conclusions about what the Wii U can or can't do until it's stripped down & the components seen.

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Where is this coming from? Your assumption that the console will not be capable of DL is shallow at best. Why would they limit themselves to single layer player when they just don't exist anymore, first of all. When the original Wii came out they ONLY produced single layer, and NEVER mentioned DL, but then years down the road introduced DL discs. In fact the assumption was all discs were required to be an exact size, which again was false. Why wouldn't they continue down this path?? They would and most likely are from what I read.

Also why wouldn't someone hack their console even if it wasn't a DL player, they would. I could rip DL’s to single layer, which is what most do right now, and play movies on the console.

I don’t understand those that think having multiple online gaming sites is bad? That competition should be good for the consumer, not bad. How you can turn this into a bad thing is way beyond comprehension.

Comment by: Interestx (Jul 09, 2011 01:15)

Mr-Movies

Where's my idea come from?

Well surely it's obviously from the fact that Nintendo have gone with their own version of a Blu-ray drive for discs of 25gb?

However if you look I am mostly suggesting that before people write their own narrative on what Wii U can and can't do we wait and see when the hardware either appears & is stripped down or is revealed.

I am suggesting it as a possibility, just how do you know that as part of their side-stepping various patents and royalties - and possibly cutting costs - that they have not opted for a laser set-up that is restricted to single layer Blu-ray reading only?

This is their first not-quite-a-Blu-ray-drive-as-you-know-it so I think it perfectly reasonable to suggest it at least possible - now we know that they are going with a 25gb limit.
As for which files it can read/use that is also very much open to question.
Blu-ray shrink?
Where?

As for the multiple on-line gaming sites, I didn't even mention that.
My own opinion is that it could be a very interesting idea.

Comment by: Mr-Movies (Jul 09, 2011 01:52)

Again that doesn't make sense if they are cost cutting they will do just like they did before and use an off the shelf unit that is optimized for their special format using a NAND, like they did before to make it secure and proprietary, like before!! Like before they never advertised DL however it was a DL player. So just like their-first-not-so-DVD-player as you would put it will be much the same with Blu-ray. Even though it is possible, and I say that loosely, what you say it just doesn't add up and you truly have no basis to say it is fact. You're just making stretched conclusions at best and I would bank that you are wrong.

You really get out there X I told you before that I would restrain jumping all over you but you just don't make it easy with the off tangent approaches you take.

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Jul 09, 2011 02:25)

Its a bad idea from the standpoint of multiple users, multiple log ins,ect. One platform has issues multiple platforms will have more issues.

Still I can not help to think that nin hands out the default online system that devs can expand on but it always goes through their basic protection systems while using all the extra stuff the dev has made, this seems more likely as everyone has their own flavor of online subsystems these "should" be able to through nins system.Think of a secured flash,html, ect driven PSN or LIVE coming through the WII U.

As for the drive issue.....nin is far to cheap to build thier own drive rather they will use a stock drive with an added chip or what not to secure it, the GC and WII could not play DVDs yet with a few hacks,ect you can make them play DVD based films.

Still the WII U looks like crap they are trying to hard to jump on the 10 year old flash game bandwagon.......

Comment by: KillerBug (Jul 09, 2011 07:33)

It is highly unlikely that they would use a laser only capable of single-layer disks; they would have to have it specially made and it would cost more.

I know nintendo blamed patents for no movie disk support, and there are some patents involved with BluRay playback that they would have to pay for, but the technology to read a bluray disk is not something that you need patents for.

As for DVD, they were just full of crap...almost every linux distro comes with DVD playback support...open source and free with no licensing needed. Windows has countless free dvd playback methods as well. If the app were written in-house, then it would not require any licensing at all. If it were based on something free, then they would only need to have you go to a website and download some token thing to make it work. Actually, they could do the second option with BluRay too.

A lot of people have said this does not matter to them...but most people don't have unlimited HDMI ports. As it is, I have a PS3, a PC, and a DVR attached to my TV...I am out of digital ports, and I am certainly not going to disconnect any of those devices just to hook up a Nintendo. I actually have more digital ports than most...what about people who have only 2 digital pots (one for the bluray, one for the DVR)? ...Or for the sad, pathetic lot who have only one HDMI port and are forced to use component video for the DVR? Maybe this is why they have a TV in the controller...because people won't have any way to connect it to their real TV.

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Jul 09, 2011 10:20)

Originally posted by KillerBug:

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A lot of people have said this does not matter to them...but most people don't have unlimited HDMI ports. As it is, I have a PS3, a PC, and a DVR attached to my TV...I am out of digital ports, and I am certainly not going to disconnect any of those devices just to hook up a Nintendo. I actually have more digital ports than most...what about people who have only 2 digital pots (one for the bluray, one for the DVR)? ...Or for the sad, pathetic lot who have only one HDMI port and are forced to use component video for the DVR? Maybe this is why they have a TV in the controller...because people won't have any way to connect it to their real TV.

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Here http://tinyurl.com/627xfa9 they work rather well. ^^

Comment by: Interestx (Jul 09, 2011 17:32)

Quite right Zippy.

Things move on too, I have a 4 porter now sitting around redundant after getting an HD receiver with 4 HDMI inputs which freed up 2 on the HD TV (which is handy for some as 1 on the TV is usually a dedicated PC input).
Although proper HDMI on PC video cards is a single cable relief my own Onkyo receiver is happy with.

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Jul 09, 2011 18:45)

Originally posted by Interestx:

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Quite right Zippy.

Things move on too, I have a 4 porter now sitting around redundant after getting an HD receiver with 4 HDMI inputs which freed up 2 on the HD TV (which is handy for some as 1 on the TV is usually a dedicated PC input).
Although proper HDMI on PC video cards is a single cable relief my own Onkyo receiver is happy with.

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Had to take my 360 off HDMI and switch to 1080p component because every time I looked at my HDMI switch the damn 360 restarted >>

So I have 3 consoles on the componaant and 1 on the HDMI and the PC is on the HDMI as well. I have a component to HDMI converter as well as a composite to component converter I do have most of the 10ish year old and newer consoles after all. (well PS2,PS3,GC,WII,360,Xbox) a 37inch vizio HD tv and a 32inch tobishia cart/SD TV for SD games that look bad in HD.

Comment by: Interestx (Jul 09, 2011 19:04)

Receivers are hilarious, my one has 4 x HDMI, 3 x opticals, 3 x coax, 3 x component, 6 x S videos & 6 x composites!

Shame they didn't ditch some of those S video & composites for some more HDMI or components
(who the hell needs 6 x Svideo and 6 x composites!?).

Mind you the latest Onkyos ditch some of the older stuff and go to 8 HDMI.

Comment by: Interestx (Jul 09, 2011 19:12)

Weird about the Xbox & the HDMI switch, that shouldn't happen, handshake issues sometimes yes but a full restart is definitely not how it ought to be.
Bummer.

I find receivers are hilarious, my one has 4 x HDMI, 3 x opticals, 3 x coax, 3 x component, 6 x Svideos & 6 x composites!
Shame they didn't ditch some of those Svideo & composites for some more HDMI or components
(who the hell needs 6 x Svideo and 6 x composites!?).
I'd love to be a fly on the wall at the meeting to debate what connections they're going to use.

Mind you the latest Onkyos ditch some of the older stuff and go to 8 HDMI which is obviously much more up-to-date & flexible.....but they still keep a ton of the old Svideo & composites - a couple I can understand but 4 Svideo & 5 compsites on the NR1009 seems a waste to me.

Comment by: Mr-Movies (Jul 09, 2011 19:14)

A lot of the good receivers are doing just that now since most people don't use or need S-Video, however you will still see component & composite as they are still used, there just won't be a ton of them. Yamaha, Denon, and Sony all are also going this path, I have not checked out a Harman Kardon lately.

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Jul 09, 2011 19:57)

I need like 5(PS2,GC,Saturn,Dreamcast,N64) composite connections :P

Comment by: Mr-Movies (Jul 09, 2011 20:32)

This would work perfect for you Zippy, the Yamaha RX-A3000.




Website for RX-A300

Comment by: nonoitall (Jul 09, 2011 20:36)

Originally posted by KillerBug:

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As for DVD, they were just full of crap...almost every linux distro comes with DVD playback support...open source and free with no licensing needed. Windows has countless free dvd playback methods as well.

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You'll notice, however, that a lot of that software includes disclaimers that state it may be illegal to use the software in certain territories. The entertainment industry has bigger fish to fry than individuals who want to watch their DVDs with free, unlicensed players, but Nintendo would make an irresistible target if they decided not to do things on the up and up.

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Jul 09, 2011 21:45)

Mr-Movies
Can it upscale SD content at 3ms or less?
I think my 10$ worth of 2 RCA switch boxes will do nicely for the SD/Svid stuff and the 5 port component switcher will do for the component stuff don't even need the hdmi switcher yet. And all of it under 30$ :P

Comment by: Mr-Movies (Jul 09, 2011 22:04)

Originally posted by ZippyDSM:

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Mr-Movies
Can it upscale SD content at 3ms or less?
I think my 10$ worth of 2 RCA switch boxes will do nicely for the SD/Svid stuff and the 5 port component switcher will do for the component stuff don't even need the hdmi switcher yet. And all of it under 30$ :P

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For sure that is much cheaper than the RX-A3000 at $1800~ I just love that receiver and it would work for you too as it has 5 composits plus everything else. You could go lower the bar with Yamaha and still make out but I'm pretty picky when it comes to audio gear and Yamaha's amps are just as good as Denon these days so you get the best of features, (DSP) and purity in your amp.

Comment by: ZippyDSM (Jul 09, 2011 22:30)

Originally posted by Mr-Movies:

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Originally posted by ZippyDSM:

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Mr-Movies
Can it upscale SD content at 3ms or less?
I think my 10$ worth of 2 RCA switch boxes will do nicely for the SD/Svid stuff and the 5 port component switcher will do for the component stuff don't even need the hdmi switcher yet. And all of it under 30$ :P

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For sure that is much cheaper than the RX-A3000 at $1800~ I just love that receiver and it would work for you too as it has 5 composits plus everything else. You could go lower the bar with Yamaha and still make out but I'm pretty picky when it comes to audio gear and Yamaha's amps are just as good as Denon these days so you get the best of features, (DSP) and purity in your amp.

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A shame it takes me half a year or so to free up 1800 when I am not in debt :P

Comment by: Interestx (Jul 10, 2011 02:19)

Everyone has their favs but personally I found that when I was buying Onkyo offered the best deal in terms of highest specs for the cash laid out.

Something like the more entry-level Onkyo 609 (was around $599 at launch so deals coming soon) might be all the receiver you ever need.

The receiver I bought also came with a standard 3yr warranty from Onkyo.

Comment by: Gnawnivek (Jul 11, 2011 17:15)

Multiple online services don't necessarily mean multiple IDs. I hope Nintendo keep it simple, one ID is all you need. I don't think I can handle multiple alias in my friend list, it's just too complicated and unnecessary.